<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Thank you everyone for your help! I've been looking at Squeak/Pharo for a few weeks because I've been creating a platform for knowledge workers to work with information that was going to be a javascript single page application. For various reasons I think it makes sense not to have a 'web-based' app and was looking for a way to create a beautiful interface atop a powerful tool that I could easily deploy to whatever platform the user may have. This was the last concern I had, so I'm going to go ahead and start whipping up some awesome code.&nbsp;<div><div apple-content-edited="true">
<span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br></div><div>David Holiday&nbsp;<br>-------------------------------------------------</div><div>San Diego State University</div><div><a href="mailto:neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu">neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu</a><br><br></div><div><br></div></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></span></span>
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<br><div><div>On Oct 15, 2013, at 5:00 AM, <a href="mailto:beginners-request@lists.squeakfoundation.org">beginners-request@lists.squeakfoundation.org</a> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div>Send Beginners mailing list submissions to<br><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span><a href="mailto:beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org">beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org</a><br><br>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners<br>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>beginners-request@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br><br>You can reach the person managing the list at<br><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>beginners-owner@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br><br>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>than "Re: Contents of Beginners digest..."<br><br><br>Today's Topics:<br><br> &nbsp;&nbsp;1. Re: sandboxing a world (Herbert K?nig)<br><br><br>----------------------------------------------------------------------<br><br>Message: 1<br>Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2013 22:25:22 +0200<br>From: Herbert K?nig &lt;herbertkoenig@gmx.net&gt;<br>Subject: Re: [Newbies] sandboxing a world<br>To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br>Message-ID: &lt;525C5332.8020308@gmx.net&gt;<br>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br><br>Hi David,<br><br>yes that's definitely possible. Back in 2006 and 2007 I did it <br>frequently for software used in the production of electronics. Meant for <br>users with no computer knowledge assumed. Those programs refused to be <br>resized in that they snapped back to their original size by changing the <br>World 's extent in the step method of the app. You may want to read the <br>World's extent to re-layout after resizing and only refuse to shrink <br>below a minimal size.<br><br>This was long ago and I assume it is not how you would do it today but <br>the process will be similar.<br><br>As a user of Windows I had a batch file with the following line:<br>Squeak_newVM.exe lockdown.image start.st<br><br>This starts the VM with a certain image and a Smalltalk script. So I <br>just copied my image and changes into that folder under a fixed name and <br>edited the class name in the script. Don't remember why I used a custom <br>VM there, but it was a minimal change I did. Maybe use the VM to fix the <br>window size.<br><br>The script read:<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;"set up autostart"<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Smalltalk addToStartUpList: PrüfRepDatenApplication . &nbsp;"The class <br>of my Application"<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;"remove the Flaps. For a recent Squeak you also might want to <br>remove the menu bar at the top. Search Preferences for 'docking'"<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Flaps globalFlapTabsIfAny do: &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;[:aFlapTab | Flaps removeFlapTab: <br>aFlapTab keepInList: false]. "usually not enabled in modern Squeak"<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;GZipReadStream fileIn: 'SqueakLockdown-nk.1.cs.gz' asFileName. <br>"this is the changeset which does the lockdown"<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Preferences disableProgrammerFacilities. &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;SmalltalkImage current <br>snapshot: true andQuit: true. "This must be on one line"<br><br>If you can't locate the the changeset, drop me an email, I will send it <br>to you so you can examine it.<br><br>In those days (and I assume still today) your class needed two class <br>side methods in category system startup:<br><br>startUp<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;implemented as self startUp: nil<br>and strartUp: anIgnoredObject<br> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;which did the initialization like self new buildGUI<br><br>Please refer to the other pointers for more up to date information. I <br>just want to give you an example illustrating the process. Especially <br>the program "Plopp" mentioned there was distributed on CD and was meant <br>for kids. I bought a copy so I know it was like any old windows program.<br><br>Cheers<br><br>Herbert<br><br><br>Am 13.10.2013 23:12, schrieb David Holiday:<br><blockquote type="cite">Hi Herbert,<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Thanks for getting back to me so quickly. As I understand you, it's<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">possible to create an application that prevents the user from seeing<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">anything but the application controls and widgets. Does this include the<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Squeak world menu bar? I'm looking to avoid having a<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">window-within-a-window situation. Ideally, to the novice eye, the end user<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">would have no indication that this is a smalltalk application.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">-david<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Send Beginners mailing list submissions to<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>beginners-request@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">You can reach the person managing the list at<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre">        </span>beginners-owner@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">than "Re: Contents of Beginners digest..."<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Today's Topics:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;1. sandboxing a world (David Holiday)<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;2. Re: sandboxing a world (Herbert K?nig)<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">----------------------------------------------------------------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Message: 1<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2013 01:23:56 -0700<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">From: David Holiday &lt;neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu&gt;<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Subject: [Newbies] sandboxing a world<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Message-ID: &lt;B8C798A9-A2CE-40A4-B0A8-86765205B84D@rohan.sdsu.edu&gt;<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Hi all,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">I'm just now getting into squeak and finding it a delightful programming<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">environment. I am, however, curious as to why some features don't seem<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">readily available. First and foremost, why isn't there a stripped down<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">version of the VM that runs Squeak programs and nothing else? That is, why<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">isn't it possible to distribute Squeak program to users in the way Java<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">developers distribute Java programs?<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To put this another way, let's say I'm a Squeak developer and I want to<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">distribute my program to a community of people that does X. Under the<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">current paradigm, all the people that do X also have to be Squeak savvy<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">people if they are going to make use of my program. They have to be savvy<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">enough to know what it is, install it, run it, install my program, and run<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">my program. Moreover, they have to know enough about the Squeak interface<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">to know what to do if they accidentally close my program window.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Conversely, with Java, the user doesn't have to know anything about Java<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">beyond downloading JVM. In this way, I can distribute my program to<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">everyone that does X without having to worry about whether or not they<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">also know anything about Squeak.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">So why isn't something like this available?<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">David Holiday<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">-------------------------------------------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">San Diego State University<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">-------------- next part --------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">URL:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/beginners/attachments/20131013/52827f6b/attachment.html<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">------------------------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Message: 2<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2013 11:21:46 +0200<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">From: Herbert K?nig &lt;herbertkoenig@gmx.net&gt;<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Subject: Re: [Newbies] sandboxing a world<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Message-ID: &lt;525A662A.2060201@gmx.net&gt;<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Hi David<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">replying to the contents of your mail not to the subject. Sandboxing is<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">a different matter.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">There are several ways to distribute Squeak as an application. The<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Squeak all in one is an example.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Disclaimer: I never distributed a packaged Squeak application myself.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">An overview:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">When Squeak is saved it starts just where it was saved, e.g. with an<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">animation (or your app) runnig.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">There's a startup list in which you can enter messages which are sent on<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">system startup. (e.g. start and initialize your app)<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Squeak can take a command line parameter which is the name of a file<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">with Smalltalk source which will be executed. This may start your app.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">There's a lockdown script which can be used to make the dev tools<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">unavailable to the end user.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Scratch and Etoys are examples of applications with the development<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">tools hidden.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">In the preferences you will find options to disable the search for a<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">sources and changes file and other things you may find useful for<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">distributing an application.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">You can resource-hack the icon of Squeak and just replace the splash<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">screen with your own picture.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">If you want an installable package, people use some of the freely<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">available installer generators.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Not sure if this list is exhaustive.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">As a first start I suggest you download the all in one from squeak.org.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Then bring your image in a state that you would call "My application<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">running". Save that image. &nbsp;Use that image and changes to replace the<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">image and changes in the all in one (Assuming you use Squeak 4.4 for<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">your app). Voila, you have a one click application that runs on Win,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Linux, Mac.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Due to the nature of Smalltalk there is no different VM for an<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">application. There is no difference beteween e.g. the compiler or your<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">application. Both are just objects that get sent messages. The VM runs<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">both in the same way.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Then maybe you can ask more specific questions.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Cheers<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Herbert<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Am 13.10.2013 10:23, schrieb David Holiday:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Hi all,<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">I'm just now getting into squeak and finding it a delightful<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">programming environment. I am, however, curious as to why some<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">features don't seem readily available. First and foremost, why isn't<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">there a stripped down version of the VM that runs Squeak programs and<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">nothing else? That is, why isn't it possible to distribute Squeak<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">program to users in the way Java developers distribute Java programs?<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">To put this another way, let's say I'm a Squeak developer and I want<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">to distribute my program to a community of people that does X. Under<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">the current paradigm, all the people that do X also have to be Squeak<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">savvy people if they are going to make use of my program. They have to<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">be savvy enough to know what it is, install it, run it, install my<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">program, and run my program. Moreover, they have to know enough about<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">the Squeak interface to know what to do if they accidentally close my<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">program window. Conversely, with Java, the user doesn't have to know<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">anything about Java beyond downloading JVM. In this way, I can<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">distribute my program to everyone that does X without having to worry<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">about whether or not they also know anything about Squeak.<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">So why isn't something like this available?<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">David Holiday<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">-------------------------------------------------<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">San Diego State University<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu &lt;mailto:neuburge@rohan.sdsu.edu&gt;<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">_______________________________________________<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Beginners mailing list<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners<br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">-------------- next part --------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">URL:<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/beginners/attachments/20131013/08bf24e2/attachment-0001.htm<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">------------------------------<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">_______________________________________________<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Beginners mailing list<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">End of Beginners Digest, Vol 90, Issue 2<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite">****************************************<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Beginners mailing list<br>Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org<br>http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners<br><br><br>End of Beginners Digest, Vol 90, Issue 4<br>****************************************<br></div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>