[Seaside] OSCON report
stephane.ducasse at free.fr
Sun Jul 30 18:05:50 UTC 2006
Thanks avi this is really really interesting.
I think that we should join forces with Wilkes because the videos are
there but totally buried (at least mine).
I should try to get some time (argh) and produce more videos.
> Since this StOR thread seems to be about reaching an audience we
> haven't had before, it's probably worth mentioning what I've been
> up to for the last week.
> I've just returned from the O'Reilly's open source OSCON
> conference. I gave a talk on Seaside very intentionally angled not
> towards convincing people to jump ship from Python/Perl/Rails etc,
> but rather towards getting them to consider some of the basic
> technologies - like the the Canvas, Component, Callback and
> Continuation model (hm, never noticed all those C's before) - for
> use in their environment of choice. However, interest was high
> enough that:
> - I gave a 45 minute talk to a packed room (some good photos at
> - followed by about 30 minutes of Q&A with most people still in the
> - followed by 3 hours of conversation with a large group at dinner
> about Seaside and Smalltalk
> - followed by a subset of that group tracking me down first thing
> the next morning and making me spend another couple of hours doing
> a Squeak demo
> What I found is that a) a huge number of these people have tried
> Squeak before, and that b) they were all very excited by what they
> saw in my (very simple) demo, but none of them had been able to
> make the journey themselves from the one to the other - that is, it
> was impossible for them to just download a Squeak image and, with
> no prior Smalltalk experience, find their way through a Hello World
> Seaside app. So they decided Squeak wasn't for them. There's also
> a huge amount of confusion and disinformation about the state of
> things like version control: essentially everyone seems to believe
> that the image is the only way to distribute Smalltalk code, and is
> understandably leery of this.
> I sensed enough goodwill, and got enough concrete offers to publish
> articles/books/etc, to think that the opportunity is there to get a
> mainstream audience for Seaside *if* (and this is a fairly large
> if) we want it and have the resources to put into it. What it
> would take, I think, is a custom Squeak distribution and tutorial/
> screencast that was aimed at a non-Smalltalk audience. It would
> need to cover:
> - The browser
> - The workspace
> - Saving, loading, and merging in Monticello
> - The basics of Seaside (a revamped "Walk on the Seaside" tutorial
> would be fine)
> An ActiveRecord-like simple O/R framework would certainly help too,
> but I think the above is a higher priority.
> Incidentally, I was asked by a few people at the conference how big
> the Seaside community was, and I was very pleased to be able to say
> "well, I almost never post to the list anymore, because other
> people are doing all the question answering, discussing, and
> committing". That's pretty cool, and an important threshold to
> cross, I think.
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