[Seaside] Seaside / smalltalk: tools and scalability

[Philippe Marschall]

Hi

Smalltalk comes in different flavors/dialects much like Lisp. Squeak
is one such dialect that is free as in beer. The two other Smalltalk
dialects that Seaside runs on are Dolphin and VisualWorks. They are
both commercial, run on windows, have refactoring, source code
management, ... I haven't heard of any Dolphin Seaside applications in
production but that doesn't mean they don't exist (they certainly
exist for VisualWorks).

The answers to some of your questions depend on which Smalltalk
dialect you want to use. For example each dialect comes with its own
source code management and although the tools are similar (they share
the same heritage) they are still a bit different. Also VisualWorks is
by far the most performant of them all. It may well be the fastest VW
for dynamic code in production use.

The VM is tied to your Smalltalk dialect. In theory you can port you
code from one dialect to an other but in practice this is a whole
different story.

Cheers
Philippe

2007/4/17, Jared Nuzzolillo <onceuponapriori at gmail.com>:
> Hello Philippe. Thanks for responding.
>
> I downloaded Squeak, but I don't need to use it. Any free 'platform' that
> fulfills the criteria I mentioned will suffice (ie, runs on windows, a rich
> class and method browser, refactoring, debugging, syntax highlighting and
> preferably code completion, some form of source control, real sites in
> production).
>
> Thanks!
> Jared
>
>
> On 4/17/07, Philippe Marschall <philippe.marschall at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi
> >
> > As you are currently using Squeak, is this the "platform" you want to
> deploy on?
> >
> > Cheers
> > Philippe
> >
> > 2007/4/17, Jared Nuzzolillo <jared at protoscript.net>:
> > > Greetings friends.
> > >
> > > As a web developer and passionate programmer, I am completely enamored
> with
> > > dynamic languages. Sadly, I have little experience with smalltalk. I've
> > > written some toy smalltalk code in the past, but most of my relevant
> > > knowledge derives from my ruby experience and smalltalk reading
> material.
> > > I've been considering delving back into smalltalk, but recent changes at
> > > work have encouraged me to delve into it sooner rather than later.
> > >
> > > To get started, I skimmed some tutorials, watched some videos and
> downloaded
> > > the Developer Image mentioned on this page:
> > > http://seaside.st/Download/Images/.
> > >
> > >  So, here are some questions:
> > >
> > > 1. Should refactoring using the R button on the Class Browser work? As a
> > > test, I tried to rename the stop method of the WAKom class? I get an
> error
> > > message to the effect of "doesNotUnderstand #getArgumentPermutation". Is
> > > there some other image I should use? I am running windows for
> development. I
> > > am open to using another, free VM instead of Squeak, if it works better
> out
> > > of the box. I need a rich class and method browser, refactoring,
> debugging,
> > > syntax highlighting and preferably code completion. I don't mind
> installing
> > > "packages" to the image either.
> > >
> > > 2. Are there any examples of Seaside (or another, similar smalltalk
> based
> > > server) running heavy-load sites? What is the largest (in terms of load)
> > > site and what sort of traffic does it receive (or alexa rating if
> > > available)? Is it trivial to set up? Part of this exercise is to
> determine
> > > whether moving to Smalltalk is a viable solution performance-wise as
> opposed
> > > to moving to java as is currently being planned by my employer.
> > >
> > > 3. I absolutely need to have good source control that will work for,
> say,
> > > two dozen developers working on one project. Is there some thing nice
> that
> > > works with #1 above?
> > >
> > > 4. Is there any educational material I just "have to" devour? A video?
> > > Tutorial or pdf? A classic text?
> > >
> > > Thank you, all. I am really exciting to begin this journey, and I hoping
> to
> > > get a head start from your collective wisdom.
> > >
> > > Best wishes,
> > > Jared
> > >
> > > ps. I realize 1 and 3 are somewhat off topic, but, since I thought there
> > > might be a "turnkey" (hate that word ;)) solution, I thought it'd be ok
> to
> > > ask.
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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> > > Seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org
> > >
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> > >
> > >
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