[Seaside] Gemstone / Magritte

Martial Boniou Martial.Boniou at ifrance.com
Tue Aug 14 17:06:12 UTC 2007


Good news! Thanks

--
Martial

Dale Henrichs a écrit :
| Just so that it is clear. For GemStone, we have removed the dependency 
| for Class>>description. There is no need to change Magritte to make it 
| easier to port to GemStone...This third party has disambiquated:)
| 
| Dale
| 
| Martial Boniou wrote:
| 
| >When I started to learn Smalltalk/squeak (after being an OpenStep
| >programmer), I mistakenly thought that the messages' categories do this
| >job. Maybe the idea of Todd, something like descriptionForMagritte
| >(there's also DescriptionForPartsBin in my Object) is not too bad IMHO.
| >Actually if the use #descriptions is possible as replacement, the use of 
| >names like #descriptionSomething, descriptionDefintion,
| >descriptionSelector are still coherent: a letter changed for less pain. 
| >
| >Globally I understand Lukas, it's very sad to loose time to change
| >things like that because of third party ambiguities.
| >
| >Cheers,
| >
| >--
| >Martial
| >
| >stephane ducasse a écrit :
| >| I was wondering if selector namespace would be of an help there.
| >| And if the complexity (tools support...and others) introduced would  
| >| be worth. I have the impression (may be bad and that goes again
| >| my language designer "role/job" that idiom-driven solution like  
| >| prefix are better to a certain
| >| point and that this is not clear when they are really bringing a  
| >| benefit).
| >| 
| >| Stef
| >| 
| >| 
| >| On 7 août 07, at 22:55, Lukas Renggli wrote:
| >| 
| >| >>Well, this issue has certainly made me think carefully about  
| >| >>introducing
| >| >>extension methods and how they're named, for sure.  But I have been
| >| >>mentioning it for about 2 years.  Not that it bothers me too much, I
| >| >>maintain my local port with #descriptor and happily use  
| >| >>#description all
| >| >>over my domain classes for a description string.
| >| >
| >| >Exactly, after all it is no big deal. The name of this method is not
| >| >particularly important to Magritte, you can answer your descriptions
| >| >from whatever method you like ...
| >| >
| >| >>>Magritte did not start as a
| >| >>>framework, but evolved from a couple of helper classes in
| >| >>>SmallWiki. It is clear that any selector name potentially
| >| >>>leads to conflicts. I agree that #descriptor would have been
| >| >>>a slightly better, but the fact that I know a couple of
| >| >>>packages that implement #descriptor is not really motivating
| >| >>>me to make that change.
| >| >>
| >| >>Understandable, have you considered whether there'd actually be  
| >| >>collisions
| >| >>with those other packages in actual use?  Glorp and OmniBrowser  
| >| >>use it, but
| >| >>not in a way that'd collide with Magritte, what other packages do  
| >| >>you know
| >| >>of?
| >| >
| >| >Personally I've never used #description for anything else, I only
| >| >observed later on that other people do. I remember considering
| >| >#asDescription, but according to Kent Beck I rejected this conversion
| >| >selector because (1) source and destination don't share the same
| >| >protocol and (2) there is not only one correct answer.
| >| >
| >| >Magritte initially started in VisualWorks. There the IO accessors, the
| >| >StORE source code management and some parts of the wrapper GUI
| >| >framework use #descriptor.
| >| >
| >| >>You're right, but they don't always use English idioms.  You're a  
| >| >>good
| >| >>example, I've tripped over a selector or two of yours before like
| >| >>beEphemeral, perfectly valid, but it doesn't feel idiomatic to me,  
| >| >>I'd
| >| >>expect the average American to say something like beTransient as  
| >| >>an opposite
| >| >>to bePersistent.  Not a big deal, just an observation.
| >| >
| >| >I got the idea from VisualWorks. They have a class called  
| >| >#Ephemeron there ;-)
| >| >
| >| >>And please, don't take any of this as bitching, I'm not, you're  
| >| >>one of my
| >| >>favorite programmers.  Much of my current style comes from things  
| >| >>I've
| >| >>learned reading Seaside and Magritte sources.
| >| >
| >| >No problem, I understand your position.
| >| >
| >| >Lukas
| >| >
| >| >-- 
| >| >Lukas Renggli
| >| >http://www.lukas-renggli.ch
| >| >_______________________________________________
| >| >Seaside mailing list
| >| >Seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org
| >| >http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
| >| >
| >| 
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| >| 
| >
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| >
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