[Seaside] [ANN] new Seaside homepage

Richard Eng richard.eng at rogers.com
Fri Jul 13 22:53:43 UTC 2007

I agree with everything you've said about Seaside. I was merely pointing out
that "heretic" doesn't sound as nice as "renegade", IMO. If you *must* use
one of these two words, which one would *you* choose?


On 7/13/07 11:54 AM, "Ramon Leon" <ramon.leon at allresnet.com> wrote:

>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: seaside-bounces at lists.squeakfoundation.org
>> [mailto:seaside-bounces at lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf
>> Of Richard Eng
>> Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 6:17 AM
>> To: Seaside - general discussion
>> Subject: Re: [Seaside] [ANN] new Seaside homepage
>> That's why I favour "the renegade web framework". Sounds less
>> negative.
>> When devising a slogan, it is very important to pay attention
>> to the emotions (subtle or otherwise) that it evokes.
>> "Visceral impact" is everything!
>> Regards,
>> Richard
> Less negative to whom?  To a manager deciding whether to allow it or not,
> I'd think that slogan does more harm than good.
> When I first started using Seaside, there was a "what the fuck" reaction.
> Then came pain, as I realized all the crap I used to do felt hard.
> Then came the "Aha!", as I realized I didn't need to do all that crap
> anymore.
> Then came the "Ahhhhhhhhhh......" as I settled down and realized what a
> pleasure it write applications with real components, that were actually
> composeable, in a framework that unlike all the rest, was truly object
> oriented.  Object oriented in the Smalltalk sense, the only language that
> actually knows what Object Oriented really means.  For the most part, that
> meant no more cookies, no more query strings, no more templates, and no more
> pages, just components calling components.
> Then I quit my corporate job and moved to a smaller company for less pay
> that would allow me to use the technology of my choosing rather than force
> me to work with established tools.  Best decision I've ever made, I've never
> been happier with work.
> Seaside isn't a renegade web framework, it's a Zen web framework for those
> tired of the suffering imposed upon us by standard web development.  Seaside
> is enlightenment come to the web.
> Seaside is to manual state management what garbage collectors were to manual
> memory management.  Many scream foul, others scream about scalability or
> speed, but history repeats itself, and just as before, automation and ease
> of use are king, and computers keep getting faster.  Those who don't get on
> board will simply be displaced by those who do.
> Ramon Leon
> http://onsmalltalk.com
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