[Seaside] [VW][7.6] Streaming?

Boris Popov boris at deepcovelabs.com
Mon Apr 21 21:33:53 UTC 2008

I appreciate the feedback Martin, the reason I brought it up is because
I upgraded to the latest-and-greatest 7.6 last week and ported to
Opentalk-Seaside at the same time. Figured might as well look into
streaming as there was some talk about it back when the project was
announced. I am not particularly missing anything given that we were on
a non-streaming server before, but it's certainly something I wouldn't
mind having if it were offered.


DeepCove Labs Ltd.
4th floor 595 Howe Street
Vancouver, Canada V6C 2T5

boris at deepcovelabs.com


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Thank you.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: seaside-bounces at lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:seaside-
> bounces at lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf Of Martin Kobetic
> Sent: Monday, April 21, 2008 2:18 PM
> To: Seaside - general discussion
> Subject: Re: [Seaside] [VW][7.6] Streaming?
> I have to admit I'm sooo not ready for this discussion, but I guess I
> better say something.
> First, when we were working on streaming integration with Seaside 2.8
> in August last year, Seaside 2.8 was nearing
> its release and it was quite late for any disruptive changes. So we
> to just hack our way through the problem and
> came up with an integration solution that we didn't like but seemed to
> working. We were planning to ship 2.8 with our
> hack-ish solution and revisit streaming later at a more opportune
time. Of
> course, as we were nearing our VW7.6 freeze
> dates we found out the hack-ish solution still had some issues, and in
> end we decided to disable the streaming
> support altogether for the 7.6 release. Right now we're working to get
> Velocity 1.0 out and consequently didn't have
> time to look at Seaside 2.9 at all. So I feel completely unprepared to
> discuss this particular problem.
> However to say at least something more specific, IIRC one of the main
> problems we ran into was that the streaming
> support back in Seaside 2.8 was pretty much hardwired so that Seaside
> itself wanted to write the HTTP headers into the
> provided socket stream. That doesn't fit our server at all. The server
> designed to write the headers and only the
> message payload/body is the responsibility of whatever the application
> layer is. There are of course mechanisms provided
> to let the app-layer add headers it wants to send, but the actually
> writing of headers out on the socket is the server's
> job. Moreover Seaside's HTTP writing support is rather simplistic and
> didn't seem prepared to deal with any of the more
> complex issues, like writing the "quoted" encoding (e.g. ?iso-8859-
> 2?Q?....?, or the base 64 variant ?B?) for non-ascii
> header values, header field folding etc. So the hack we had was really
> suppressing all that in our server code and
> letting Seaside do its thing, as much as it could. I'm not sure
anymore if
> the problems that lead us to disable
> streaming were due to Seaside's limited HTTP abilities or not.
> Either way we hoped to convince the Seaside folks that, rather than
> a bit here and bit there, Seaside should just
> stay away from HTTP writing/parsing as much as it can. So in the
> mode the desired set of headers should be
> handed over to the server upfront and then there should be a separate
> from the server back to Seaside to write just
> the streamed body into a provided socket stream. This may well be the
> direction that 2.9 already went, I don't know.
> There were more things we wanted to bring up, but I'll have to go back
> find out.
> Martin
> Boris Popov wrote:
> > Ah, perhaps I misunderstood Michael then, I'll wait for
> > from Martin...
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > -Boris
> >
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