[Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now concrete proposals

Sat Apr 18 02:59:36 UTC 2009

Mr. Robertson,

If the name behind facts is your *only concern* and the precondition for you to think about serious and well funded critics, then you are not only outclassing yourself but you are proving that I am absolutely right to stay anonymous.

> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you  
> insist on a veil of anonymity.
If you, too, judge people's opinion by their name only, you are issuing an evidence of incapacity for yourself!

Several emails within this very first day of my blog have assured me that it is time to speak out openly - without this stupid US-made "political correctness" (which means lying) and without false politeness - about some facts and critics that obviously bother far more people than just me, most of whom just don't want conflicts and therefore keep quiet.

I have my bad experiences with Smalltalk providers (at this moment I am keeping names away) and I will not waste my time to fight their possible pressure.

Please, all, let's forget about this personal discussion. I have added a lot more concrete proposals to my blog. Let's discuss these.

Mr. Robertson: You should rather do something about the still very questionable (to be fiendly) user interface of VisualWorks to finally unveil the full potential of this tool - instead of discussing names of critics.

Best reagards
Mr. Cucumber
(I like that nick!)

-------- Original-Nachricht --------
> Datum: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 21:51:42 -0400
> Von: James Robertson <jrobertson at cincom.com>
> An: Seaside - general discussion <seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
> Betreff: Re: [Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now concrete	proposals

> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you  
> insist on a veil of anonymity.  Seaside is not some political group,  
> and you aren't a revolutionary.  Let us know who you are, and make  
> your comments constructively, rather than destructively.
> 
> You've already seen how people are taking the kind of rhetoric you're  
> dishing out, so I guess I'll ask you this: how's that working out for  
> you so far?
> 
> James Robertson
> Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
> Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Apr 17, 2009, at 8:23 PM, TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch wrote:
> 
> > I have added some first concrete proposals to my new critical blog  
> > on Seaside: http://thesmalltalkblog.blogspot.com
> >
> > May I also propose to get away from these personal and emotional  
> > discussions here and to advance to some proper work. I have started  
> > with my proposals on my blog.
> >
> > As Keith wrote very wisely (thank you Keith):
> >
> >> Mr Cucumber is raising issues. We need to identify the actual  
> >> issues and
> > see if they need addressing.<
> > See my latest postings on my blog! I am getting into the subjects!
> >
> >
> > And Keith, thank you again for this:
> >
> >> Personally I dont see much anger in his blog, I see honesty as  
> >> expressed from his perception. In fact there is far less anger  
> >> expressed here than I would expect.<
> >
> > I had expected this reaction from the mailing list, because I know  
> > well how such communities work. They are - at least by the "leading  
> > members" - social entities where the argument as such is mostly less  
> > important than who raises it. We are all humans! That's natural but  
> > not helpful.
> >
> > Ths is exactly what Sebastian Sastre wrote:
> >
> >> And you did it annonymously, which leaves your ideas in a weaker  
> >> position. What did you pretend with that? to create the annonymous  
> >> seaside critic comunity?
> >> leaded by whom?
> >
> > @Sebastian: If you value an argument from a person who's name you  
> > know higher because just of that, pardonnez-moi, je m'excuse, but  
> > this would a clear sign of incompetence.
> >
> >> leaded by whom?
> > Only led by arguments!
> >
> > This is also another reason why I will stay anonymous. I want to  
> > improve the subject and not gain personal respect by some community  
> > (as Thorsten proposed and wrote that this is a prerequisite to be  
> > taken seriously). Forget it!
> >
> > Either people believe in my arguments and want to profit from my  
> > very comprehensive experience - or not. In the latter case we will  
> > continue in our own style as we did in the past. Nothing lost.
> >
> > Or I might find some people who are willing to jump onto our boat  
> > and travel with us, because we share the same believes and goals. In  
> > this case we would just subclass (as we already did in many cases)  
> > where major changes are wanted and that's it!
> >
> > Seaside is too important for us to either forget about it or to live  
> > with - sorry for my openess - this horrible lausy amateurish and  
> > undocumented code of Release 2.8. This is unacceptable for us to  
> > build products upon.
> >
> > These authors of Seaside (whom I don't know) really had some crazy  
> > ideas!
> >
> > Just remember this f... (4-letter word left out with respect to  
> > those who believe in PC)stupid idiotic url path "/Seaside/do".
> >
> > What a crazy idea!
> >
> > It took us several days in the beginning to get this rubbish out! It  
> > was done in such a fancy way that was really difficult for somebody  
> > not (yet) knowing the system. And there were many complains about  
> > that here on the list.
> >
> > What an idiotic and unrealistic idea! And why so badly implemented.
> >
> > Now, you can't expect me to have respect for people doing such a  
> > bullshit! And my expectation from life experience*** was that these  
> > people would be immune to advice. This is why I chose the public  
> > block to discuss improvements outside this "social community" here!
> >
> > Therefore, don't expect me to participate here too frequently. I  
> > have no time for such discussions. I want to get my project moving  
> > and that means improving Seaside.
> >
> > Everybody is welcome to join - and I will be most eager and happy to  
> > learn from other people's experiences and follow their advice. But  
> > now on this previous low-level of "Seaside standards". Non, merci!
> >
> >
> > ***
> > I software development experience is very much like cylinder  
> > capacity in motor construction! There is only one way to improve  
> > cylinder capacity - and that is by more cylinder capacity!
> >
> >
> >
> > -- 
> > Psssst! Schon vom neuen GMX MultiMessenger gehört? Der kann`s mit  
> > allen: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/multimessenger01
> > _______________________________________________
> > seaside mailing list
> > seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org
> > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
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