[Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now concrete proposals

James Robertson jrobertson at cincom.com
Sat Apr 18 03:11:45 UTC 2009


Sigh.  I'll make a final point, and - since I think this will remain  
pointless - give you all the attention you deserve from here on out.

If you have the courage of your convictions, then stand behind them.   
If you won't, then I have to assume you don't actually have any  
convictions, and are here in some weird attempt to pump up your own  
ego.  So be it; I've said my piece, and I don't see any reason to  
engage further.

You've succeeded; I simply won't take any posts you make this way  
seriously - in this or any other forum.

James Robertson
Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library




On Apr 17, 2009, at 10:59 PM, TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch wrote:

> Mr. Robertson,
>
> If the name behind facts is your *only concern* and the precondition  
> for you to think about serious and well funded critics, then you are  
> not only outclassing yourself but you are proving that I am  
> absolutely right to stay anonymous.
>
>> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you
>> insist on a veil of anonymity.
> If you, too, judge people's opinion by their name only, you are  
> issuing an evidence of incapacity for yourself!
>
> Several emails within this very first day of my blog have assured me  
> that it is time to speak out openly - without this stupid US-made  
> "political correctness" (which means lying) and without false  
> politeness - about some facts and critics that obviously bother far  
> more people than just me, most of whom just don't want conflicts and  
> therefore keep quiet.
>
> I have my bad experiences with Smalltalk providers (at this moment I  
> am keeping names away) and I will not waste my time to fight their  
> possible pressure.
>
> Please, all, let's forget about this personal discussion. I have  
> added a lot more concrete proposals to my blog. Let's discuss these.
>
> Mr. Robertson: You should rather do something about the still very  
> questionable (to be fiendly) user interface of VisualWorks to  
> finally unveil the full potential of this tool - instead of  
> discussing names of critics.
>
> Best reagards
> Mr. Cucumber
> (I like that nick!)
>
>
>
>
> -------- Original-Nachricht --------
>> Datum: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 21:51:42 -0400
>> Von: James Robertson <jrobertson at cincom.com>
>> An: Seaside - general discussion <seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
>> Betreff: Re: [Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now  
>> concrete	proposals
>
>> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you
>> insist on a veil of anonymity.  Seaside is not some political group,
>> and you aren't a revolutionary.  Let us know who you are, and make
>> your comments constructively, rather than destructively.
>>
>> You've already seen how people are taking the kind of rhetoric you're
>> dishing out, so I guess I'll ask you this: how's that working out for
>> you so far?
>>
>> James Robertson
>> Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
>> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
>> Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Apr 17, 2009, at 8:23 PM, TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch wrote:
>>
>>> I have added some first concrete proposals to my new critical blog
>>> on Seaside: http://thesmalltalkblog.blogspot.com
>>>
>>> May I also propose to get away from these personal and emotional
>>> discussions here and to advance to some proper work. I have started
>>> with my proposals on my blog.
>>>
>>> As Keith wrote very wisely (thank you Keith):
>>>
>>>> Mr Cucumber is raising issues. We need to identify the actual
>>>> issues and
>>> see if they need addressing.<
>>> See my latest postings on my blog! I am getting into the subjects!
>>>
>>>
>>> And Keith, thank you again for this:
>>>
>>>> Personally I dont see much anger in his blog, I see honesty as
>>>> expressed from his perception. In fact there is far less anger
>>>> expressed here than I would expect.<
>>>
>>> I had expected this reaction from the mailing list, because I know
>>> well how such communities work. They are - at least by the "leading
>>> members" - social entities where the argument as such is mostly less
>>> important than who raises it. We are all humans! That's natural but
>>> not helpful.
>>>
>>> Ths is exactly what Sebastian Sastre wrote:
>>>
>>>> And you did it annonymously, which leaves your ideas in a weaker
>>>> position. What did you pretend with that? to create the annonymous
>>>> seaside critic comunity?
>>>> leaded by whom?
>>>
>>> @Sebastian: If you value an argument from a person who's name you
>>> know higher because just of that, pardonnez-moi, je m'excuse, but
>>> this would a clear sign of incompetence.
>>>
>>>> leaded by whom?
>>> Only led by arguments!
>>>
>>> This is also another reason why I will stay anonymous. I want to
>>> improve the subject and not gain personal respect by some community
>>> (as Thorsten proposed and wrote that this is a prerequisite to be
>>> taken seriously). Forget it!
>>>
>>> Either people believe in my arguments and want to profit from my
>>> very comprehensive experience - or not. In the latter case we will
>>> continue in our own style as we did in the past. Nothing lost.
>>>
>>> Or I might find some people who are willing to jump onto our boat
>>> and travel with us, because we share the same believes and goals. In
>>> this case we would just subclass (as we already did in many cases)
>>> where major changes are wanted and that's it!
>>>
>>> Seaside is too important for us to either forget about it or to live
>>> with - sorry for my openess - this horrible lausy amateurish and
>>> undocumented code of Release 2.8. This is unacceptable for us to
>>> build products upon.
>>>
>>> These authors of Seaside (whom I don't know) really had some crazy
>>> ideas!
>>>
>>> Just remember this f... (4-letter word left out with respect to
>>> those who believe in PC)stupid idiotic url path "/Seaside/do".
>>>
>>> What a crazy idea!
>>>
>>> It took us several days in the beginning to get this rubbish out! It
>>> was done in such a fancy way that was really difficult for somebody
>>> not (yet) knowing the system. And there were many complains about
>>> that here on the list.
>>>
>>> What an idiotic and unrealistic idea! And why so badly implemented.
>>>
>>> Now, you can't expect me to have respect for people doing such a
>>> bullshit! And my expectation from life experience*** was that these
>>> people would be immune to advice. This is why I chose the public
>>> block to discuss improvements outside this "social community" here!
>>>
>>> Therefore, don't expect me to participate here too frequently. I
>>> have no time for such discussions. I want to get my project moving
>>> and that means improving Seaside.
>>>
>>> Everybody is welcome to join - and I will be most eager and happy to
>>> learn from other people's experiences and follow their advice. But
>>> now on this previous low-level of "Seaside standards". Non, merci!
>>>
>>>
>>> ***
>>> I software development experience is very much like cylinder
>>> capacity in motor construction! There is only one way to improve
>>> cylinder capacity - and that is by more cylinder capacity!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Psssst! Schon vom neuen GMX MultiMessenger gehört? Der kann`s mit
>>> allen: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/multimessenger01
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>>>
>>
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