[Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now concrete proposals

Sat Apr 18 03:23:18 UTC 2009

2009/4/18  <TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch>:
> Classical ignorant arrogancy - typical for a big US company!
>

Peter, on your place i would just walk away and let the people fall
victims of their own ignorance and stupidity, if you think they are.
If not, then show them RESPECT.

> Quod erat demonstradum! No suprise!
>
> Greeting from Europe!
>
>
> -------- Original-Nachricht --------
>> Datum: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 23:11:45 -0400
>> Von: James Robertson <jrobertson at cincom.com>
>> An: Seaside - general discussion <seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
>> Betreff: Re: [Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now concrete  proposals
>
>> Sigh.  I'll make a final point, and - since I think this will remain
>> pointless - give you all the attention you deserve from here on out.
>>
>> If you have the courage of your convictions, then stand behind them.
>> If you won't, then I have to assume you don't actually have any
>> convictions, and are here in some weird attempt to pump up your own
>> ego.  So be it; I've said my piece, and I don't see any reason to
>> engage further.
>>
>> You've succeeded; I simply won't take any posts you make this way
>> seriously - in this or any other forum.
>>
>> James Robertson
>> Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
>> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
>> Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Apr 17, 2009, at 10:59 PM, TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch wrote:
>>
>> > Mr. Robertson,
>> >
>> > If the name behind facts is your *only concern* and the precondition
>> > for you to think about serious and well funded critics, then you are
>> > not only outclassing yourself but you are proving that I am
>> > absolutely right to stay anonymous.
>> >
>> >> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you
>> >> insist on a veil of anonymity.
>> > If you, too, judge people's opinion by their name only, you are
>> > issuing an evidence of incapacity for yourself!
>> >
>> > Several emails within this very first day of my blog have assured me
>> > that it is time to speak out openly - without this stupid US-made
>> > "political correctness" (which means lying) and without false
>> > politeness - about some facts and critics that obviously bother far
>> > more people than just me, most of whom just don't want conflicts and
>> > therefore keep quiet.
>> >
>> > I have my bad experiences with Smalltalk providers (at this moment I
>> > am keeping names away) and I will not waste my time to fight their
>> > possible pressure.
>> >
>> > Please, all, let's forget about this personal discussion. I have
>> > added a lot more concrete proposals to my blog. Let's discuss these.
>> >
>> > Mr. Robertson: You should rather do something about the still very
>> > questionable (to be fiendly) user interface of VisualWorks to
>> > finally unveil the full potential of this tool - instead of
>> > discussing names of critics.
>> >
>> > Best reagards
>> > Mr. Cucumber
>> > (I like that nick!)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > -------- Original-Nachricht --------
>> >> Datum: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 21:51:42 -0400
>> >> Von: James Robertson <jrobertson at cincom.com>
>> >> An: Seaside - general discussion <seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org>
>> >> Betreff: Re: [Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - now
>> >> concrete   proposals
>> >
>> >> It's really, really hard to take anything you say seriously when you
>> >> insist on a veil of anonymity.  Seaside is not some political group,
>> >> and you aren't a revolutionary.  Let us know who you are, and make
>> >> your comments constructively, rather than destructively.
>> >>
>> >> You've already seen how people are taking the kind of rhetoric you're
>> >> dishing out, so I guess I'll ask you this: how's that working out for
>> >> you so far?
>> >>
>> >> James Robertson
>> >> Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
>> >> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
>> >> Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Apr 17, 2009, at 8:23 PM, TheSmalltalkBlog at gmx.ch wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> I have added some first concrete proposals to my new critical blog
>> >>> on Seaside: http://thesmalltalkblog.blogspot.com
>> >>>
>> >>> May I also propose to get away from these personal and emotional
>> >>> discussions here and to advance to some proper work. I have started
>> >>> with my proposals on my blog.
>> >>>
>> >>> As Keith wrote very wisely (thank you Keith):
>> >>>
>> >>>> Mr Cucumber is raising issues. We need to identify the actual
>> >>>> issues and
>> >>> see if they need addressing.<
>> >>> See my latest postings on my blog! I am getting into the subjects!
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> And Keith, thank you again for this:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Personally I dont see much anger in his blog, I see honesty as
>> >>>> expressed from his perception. In fact there is far less anger
>> >>>> expressed here than I would expect.<
>> >>>
>> >>> I had expected this reaction from the mailing list, because I know
>> >>> well how such communities work. They are - at least by the "leading
>> >>> members" - social entities where the argument as such is mostly less
>> >>> important than who raises it. We are all humans! That's natural but
>> >>> not helpful.
>> >>>
>> >>> Ths is exactly what Sebastian Sastre wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> And you did it annonymously, which leaves your ideas in a weaker
>> >>>> position. What did you pretend with that? to create the annonymous
>> >>>> seaside critic comunity?
>> >>>> leaded by whom?
>> >>>
>> >>> @Sebastian: If you value an argument from a person who's name you
>> >>> know higher because just of that, pardonnez-moi, je m'excuse, but
>> >>> this would a clear sign of incompetence.
>> >>>
>> >>>> leaded by whom?
>> >>> Only led by arguments!
>> >>>
>> >>> This is also another reason why I will stay anonymous. I want to
>> >>> improve the subject and not gain personal respect by some community
>> >>> (as Thorsten proposed and wrote that this is a prerequisite to be
>> >>> taken seriously). Forget it!
>> >>>
>> >>> Either people believe in my arguments and want to profit from my
>> >>> very comprehensive experience - or not. In the latter case we will
>> >>> continue in our own style as we did in the past. Nothing lost.
>> >>>
>> >>> Or I might find some people who are willing to jump onto our boat
>> >>> and travel with us, because we share the same believes and goals. In
>> >>> this case we would just subclass (as we already did in many cases)
>> >>> where major changes are wanted and that's it!
>> >>>
>> >>> Seaside is too important for us to either forget about it or to live
>> >>> with - sorry for my openess - this horrible lausy amateurish and
>> >>> undocumented code of Release 2.8. This is unacceptable for us to
>> >>> build products upon.
>> >>>
>> >>> These authors of Seaside (whom I don't know) really had some crazy
>> >>> ideas!
>> >>>
>> >>> Just remember this f... (4-letter word left out with respect to
>> >>> those who believe in PC)stupid idiotic url path "/Seaside/do".
>> >>>
>> >>> What a crazy idea!
>> >>>
>> >>> It took us several days in the beginning to get this rubbish out! It
>> >>> was done in such a fancy way that was really difficult for somebody
>> >>> not (yet) knowing the system. And there were many complains about
>> >>> that here on the list.
>> >>>
>> >>> What an idiotic and unrealistic idea! And why so badly implemented.
>> >>>
>> >>> Now, you can't expect me to have respect for people doing such a
>> >>> bullshit! And my expectation from life experience*** was that these
>> >>> people would be immune to advice. This is why I chose the public
>> >>> block to discuss improvements outside this "social community" here!
>> >>>
>> >>> Therefore, don't expect me to participate here too frequently. I
>> >>> have no time for such discussions. I want to get my project moving
>> >>> and that means improving Seaside.
>> >>>
>> >>> Everybody is welcome to join - and I will be most eager and happy to
>> >>> learn from other people's experiences and follow their advice. But
>> >>> now on this previous low-level of "Seaside standards". Non, merci!
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> ***
>> >>> I software development experience is very much like cylinder
>> >>> capacity in motor construction! There is only one way to improve
>> >>> cylinder capacity - and that is by more cylinder capacity!
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
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>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> seaside mailing list
>> >>> seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org
>> >>> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
>> >>>
>> >>
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>> >
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>> >
>>
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>
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-- 
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko AKA sig.