[Seaside] A new critical blog discussing Seaside - Comment my blog

stephane ducasse stephane.ducasse at free.fr
Sat Apr 18 15:39:12 UTC 2009

Just a side remark: seaside code quality is not equal to squeak-one.
So pay attention not to generalize too fast.

I know it since we are cleaning squeak in pharo http://www.pharo-project.org
there is still a lot of work but everyday this is getting better.
We already have a lot more tests than most of smalltalk  
distributions. :)
We will run SmallLint on all our packages...


PS: about accessor K. Beck book is not that black and white as  
Smalltalk with style. :)

> Hi "Smalltalkers"!
> I can well remember Stephane Ducasse's closing words on last ESUG ,  
> when he said, that time is come for all Smalltalk users and  
> companies to throw all there knowledge and efforts together to  
> achieve the same aim, making Smalltalk more public and modern again.

I said that :) I do not remember. It was cool :)

> I have the impression that some guys need to be brought back down on  
> earth.
> Seaside is a Open Source project which is squeak based. If I would  
> blame the Seaside development team for working inacurate, regarding  
> coding conventions, I could blame a lot of Squeak-Based projects on  
> that. Some things like instance variable accessing is typically done  
> without accessor- and getter-methods within Squeak. I don't like  
> that too, but to be honest, I don't have the time to offer a  
> overworked version to the coreteam. I guess I'm not the only one  
> here...
> It's definetly true that Seaside is one of the most interesting  
> projects in the Smalltalk market right now, giving companies the  
> chance to offer something new and up-to-date.
> But I also think it's merely impossible to develop a smalltalk  
> project in squeak with the abillity to fullfill all advantages of  
> the ported target systems, like VW, VASmalltalk, Gemstone and  
> Dolphin...
> It's the business of Cincom, Instantiations, Gemstone, ObjectArts  
> and projects using Seaside for many years now, to support and  
> influence and support actual Seaside development in squeak to assure  
> the usability and optimization of Seaside Core.
> You can't offer the world a kind of combination of domestic animal  
> that produces eggs, wool, milk and can be grilled, or as we say in  
> Germany "eine Eierlegendewollmilchsau" and additional to that: "for  
> free".
> Seaside is not a completed proprietary product, but everybody  
> expects a robust in changes and optimal basis for writing a new next  
> gerneration 15 years lasting  Webapplication framework for the own  
> product family.
> Seaside is a sparetime project and it's a democratic project.  
> Everybody can join the Coreteam and can expend time to push it  
> forward.
> Well, I'm happy for everyone beeing able to get some money out of  
> Seaside.
> And I' m sure the whole Smalltalk community would be glad about more  
> Seasiders and Seaside-Profiteers helping Smalltalk to become more  
> interessing to newcomers again and support others to get a hand on  
> Seaside.
> Blogs like onsmalltalk.com for example, are worther than comments in  
> alternating alpha release classes.
> Thank's to everyone presenting, writing tutorials, books, blogs and  
> thanks to the coreteam for the help and advice you gave to me past  
> month!
> Thanks Cucumber for speaking out load what you think. There are  
> several point's I often have in mind reading over "Squeak-Code", but  
> some points might be hard to be solved just because nobody knows,  
> where the Seaside is heading to.
> The actual effords in seperating plattformdependent coding from  
> seasidecoding is an improvement I really appreciate.  It clearly  
> shows that these guys are willing to give a larger community an  
> access to Seaside. I could imagine that this is a lot harder than  
> just staying in Squeak.
> Profit in mind or not, I don't care. They deserve it.
> [|]
> Sebastian
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