Is this list a chat or a list REALLY ?

Andrew C. Greenberg werdna at mucow.com
Fri Aug 10 00:34:14 UTC 2001


>     - why the open-source model of squeak does not work?

All evidence to the contrary.  The product is exquisite, dynamic and 
constantly improving so far as I can see.  The community, though there 
are certainly some gadflies, comprises extraordinarily talented people 
who regularly contribute.

>     For example I do not really know the other open source movements but
>     it seems that we could have
>         - call for improvement where people could argue why a
>         crucial change have to be done.

This happens with great frequency in my experience.  Even Stephen's 
message is an exemplar for the proposition that this routinely occurs.

>         - much better enhancement integration instead of waiting that 
> SqC
>         agrees or does the job (I think that this should not be their 
> role).
>         I have the feeling that Squeak is not open. This is not intended
>         against SqC but against the process itself.

With all due respect, Bunk.  Raw bunk.  Silly bunk.  Contributions are 
readily available on the list, and are often made available at websites 
or Swikis until they are accepted by the community and/or adopted by 
SqC.  SqC routinely solicits contributions, particularly during version 
cycles.  My personal experience is that I frequently have had my 
contributions added to the image -- and, hey, I'm just an annoying 
lawyer.  And how is this any different from any of the myriad successful 
centralized open source products?  FreeBSD?  Apache?  Zope?  Python?  
Linux (the Kernel)?

>         I'm thinking that we are too self-oriented and not looking for
>         successes of the other communities.

I agree that Morphic is quite self-oriented, but some on our list would 
argue that it isn't enough like self.  I suspect this isn't what was 
intended, but in fact have no idea what was meant by this.  Perhaps an 
illustration would help?

>         - having a infrastructure that support changes identification 
> in a
>         much better way that changeset so that we can built a squeak 
> from a
>         list of modules.

Great.  Why not make one?

>         - For example VMMkaer is a good way to support the distribution 
> and
>         building of VM

Great.  Why not make one?

> So I expect at least one of you to say just do it!

Sure -- just do it.

> I do what I can ;)
>
> But are you really sure that I'm wrong.

Pretty much, but I always keep my mind open.  You should do so as well.




More information about the Squeak-dev mailing list