Comic Fonts again...
ned at bike-nomad.com
Tue Apr 13 18:44:51 UTC 2004
To continue a discussion that wasn't properly concluded...
On Thursday 19 February 2004 4:42 pm, Doug Way wrote:
> Now, there were also the Comic bitmap fonts which were removed, which
> did not really have a close equivalent in the Accufonts... you may be
> referring more to these. (The replacement used for these was Accujen,
> which is at least sans-serif.) The Comic fonts were actually not Apple
> fonts, but fonts "borrowed" from MS. So, there was no Squeak-L related
> reason to remove these, but they were also removed simply because they
> weren't legitimate free fonts. However, there is some question as to
> whether bitmap fonts are copyrightable at all, apparently there are
> recent rulings indicating that they are not, so you could make the
> argument that the Comic bitmap fonts should have been left alone. I
> decided to go along with the original StableSqueak decision to remove
> them, though... seemed like the safer course of action. Do people think
> that we should re-add these fonts?
* The 'Comic' name is probably trademarked (though bitmap fonts themselves
aren't copyrightable in the US, their names are usually trademarked).
* The StrikeFonts are in MacRoman encoding; this doesn't work well for the
m17n work (where Latin-1 is preferred).
* The StrikeFonts do not have international glyphs (especially Japanese).
I think we should remove ComicSansMS (see below) and find (or construct) a
replacement, licensed or freely distributable, TrueType font that is suitable
for Etoys and that includes a wider set of glyphs.
On Tuesday 27 January 2004 11:06 pm, jp1660 at att.net wrote:
> And Microsoft's withdrawn the free distribution of Comic Sans besides.
They have quit distributing it but they haven't changed the license terms for
those of us who got it earlier.
The EULA (End-user license agreement) states:
1. GRANT OF LICENSE. This EULA grants you the following rights:
* Installation and Use. You may install and use an unlimited number of
copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT.
* Reproduction and Distribution. You may reproduce and distribute an
unlimited number of copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT; provided that each copy
shall be a true and complete copy, including all copyright and trademark
notices, and shall be accompanied by a copy of this EULA. Copies of the
SOFTWARE PRODUCT may not be distributed for profit either on a standalone
basis or included as part of your own product.
And from their FAQ (now posted at http://corefonts.sourceforge.net/faq8.htm):
Q What can I do with these fonts?
A For all the rules that govern the use of these fonts please read the end
user license agreement.
* Anyone can download and install these fonts for their own use.
* Designers can specify the fonts within their Web pages. Our guide to
specifying fonts in Web pages explains how to do this.
* You may only redistribute the fonts in their original form (.exe
or .sit.hqx) and with their original file name from your Web site or intranet
* You must not supply the fonts, or any derivative fonts based on them, in
any form that adds value to commercial products, such as CD-ROM or disk based
multimedia programs, application software or utilities. See Microsoft's
permissions site for more details.
Sounds like we're not following their rules here.
On Tuesday 27 January 2004 1:47 pm, Doug Way wrote:
> This changeset does not remove the ComicSansMS TrueType font (yet),
> which probably should be removed, because outline fonts definitely are
> copyrightable, and this is not a free font either as far as I know.
> However, I was going to wait and possibly remove this one as part of
> incorporating the BitStream Vera TrueType fonts, so we have a bunch of
> replacement TT fonts before getting rid of this one.
On Saturday 21 February 2004 6:43 pm, Andreas Raab wrote:
> The document is here:
> Comic (as well as Verdana, Tahoma and a whole bunch of others) were shipped
> as the MS web font pack with "installable embedding" rights. No restriction
> whatsoever to have them inside Squeak.
On Monday 23 February 2004 10:34 am, Doug Way wrote:
> Okay then, if there are truly no restrictions on the ComicSansMS
> truetype font, then I won't take it out when adding the Bitstream Vera
As it stands in 3.7b we have embedded the ComicSansMS (as a TTCFont) but *not*
the ComicSansBoldMS. But there are a number of places where the ComicBold
font was used (especially in Etoys); we really should consider coming up with
a suitable alternative.
Yoshiki, what do you need for Japanese Etoys?
GPG key ID: BEEA7EFE
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