Monticello, SM2, BFAV in 3.7alpha (was Re: Error during install of KomHttpServer 6.2 in Squeak3.7a-5657 image)

goran.krampe at goran.krampe at
Mon Jan 26 18:15:02 UTC 2004

Hi Doug and all!

Off the top of my head:

Doug Way <dway at> wrote:
> goran.krampe at wrote:
> >PS. We did more or less decide to stuff Monticello into Basic - perhaps
> >it is high time now that SM2 is running?
> >
> We could, if the current version of Monticello is reasonably stable.  We 
> should at least put it on the to-do list for 3.7alpha if we're sure we 
> want to add it.

Yes, we can wait a bit.

> We also need to update the in-image version of SqueakMap to SM2 sometime 
> before 3.7 goes beta in a couple of weeks.  We could perhaps wait a bit 
> longer for a few more bugs to be flushed out.

Yes. I have smashed most of them I think, right now I have the
"Jazzmynn-bug" which evidently had to do with HFS on MacOS not handling
directory names >30 characters (SM uses UUIDs which are 36 characters
long in String form).

Haven't decided how to resolve that one yet.

> Also, at some point someone was talking about adding BFAV or a BFAV 
> bootstrap in the alpha image.  I agree that it would be good to have 
> BFAV in the open menu, so that it's really easy to get to, which would 
> encourage more widespread use.  In this case, I think a bootstrap might 
> be better... BFAV is not as much of a core infrastructure thing which 
> other things depend on, like SM and Monticello are.  (Case in point: the 
> BFAV bootstrap would require SM to already be present in order to work.)
> So, the BFAV bootstrap appear in the open menu and would simply load the 
> latest BFAV2 package from SM2, and open the viewer.  Is there an SM2 

Yes, in fact - we could easily put a few "selected tools" available in a
special menu.
Perhaps not in the open-menu, how about having a "install recommended
tools"-menu? Or something similar.

Here is a proposal:

- Let us introduce a category in SM called "Recommended tool" or
something like that.
- Create a menu which simply pulls the name, description, UUID etc from
the map instead of being hardcoded.
- From 3.7, always ship the image with a map.

This last bullet is interesting. Today we actually more or less
"accidentally" ship the image with a map in it. We have a few choices:

1. Ship image without map inside. This means the menu mentioned above
wouldn't be available until you connect with the net and update the map.
2. Ship image with a map inside. Menu is available immediately, and if
the image has been unzipped in a directory where the "sm" directory has
a preloaded cache - the package loader could install packages directly
without a net connection. (Note: Current loader tries to load updates
when opened - we might want to change that)
3. Ship image without map inside, but include an "sm" dir with the map
on disk. It will autosynch when loading updates.

Personally I haven't decided what is "best". Being able to ship only two
files is nice (image/changes) of course. But eventually I think, as the
image shrinks more and more, shipping with a preloaded "sm" dir
(prefilled cache) will be better.


> command to easily load whatever is the most recent version of a 
> package?  Or should the bootstrap be hardcoded to a particular version 
> for now?
> - Doug

Well, the above proposal would make the menu "controlled" from the
outside. But if we disregard that for a second - installing the latest
release is easy:

"This installs the latest release of BFAV2"
SMSqueakMap default installPackageWithId:

...there are also other variants - see all messages in SMSqueakMap
beginning with "install...".

...BUT we could also argue that it is BETTER to have the image "in full
control of itself". Then perhaps we should *not* pull the "recommended
tools" from SM using a dedicated category - and instead have a list of
UUIDs in the image somewhere. If this is a direction to consider - then
we should probably also list specific releases - because then the image
will not "behave" differently with time.

In that case I can recommend:

"This installs the 2.03 release of BFAV2"
SMSqueakMap default installPackageReleaseWithId:

regards, Göran

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