Rita, that is very interesting as I was wondering about whether the
"show code textually" was actually used by kids/students. I do wish
that EToys was in some ways more accessible as I always feel that I am
about to break everything, I have lost count of the number of times I
have quit squeak without saving to be able to recover the original
version of a project I was working on, and I am sure that there is an
easier way of doing this but I could not find it.

It would be great if there was more documentation out there and there
where more resources for teaching smalltalk, I found it sad when I
heard on FLOSS Weakly 66 that programs where being written for the
OLPC in HTML / Javascript because smalltalk was seen as being
difficult.

2009/7/1 Rita Freudenberg <rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de>:
> Ryan Simmons wrote:
>>
>> I some ways I agree with Ramon, that Squeak should become more aimed
>> at developers.
>>
>> I do however feel that education is very important I was especially
>> impressed by Dr. Geo II.
>> I feel that EToys, Dr. Geo etc  should become applications that can be
>> loaded in very much like Seaside can be loaded into a variety of
>> smalltalks.
>>
>> I will probably not be too popular for saying the following, but I
>> fail to see how EToys helps to teach children the use of smalltalk,
>> (and hence why I am confused that so many feel that it should be part
>> of Squeak) if it is there to help teach programming concepts to
>> children then I would also have to say that Scratch seems to be a much
>> better tool for doing this.
>>
>
> When I'm building Etoys scripts with teachers and I show them the option in
> a scriptor "show code textually" they are surprised and interested.  Because
> for kids/students, who are eager to learn more that's a way to show them
> what is "under the hood".  You can even go all the way to the class browser
> and look for your etoys objects and scripts. That's not really easy at the
> moment, but I think that is something worth to work on! We have BotsInc,
> too, as a learning tool of how to use the squeak environment. What we need
> are ideas about how to better integrate these parts. And of course we need
> documentation, so that all the wonderful features of Squeak are accessible.
>
> Rita
>>
>> 2009/7/1 Stéphane Rollandin <lecteur at zogotounga.net>:
>>
>>>>
>>>> +10
>>>>
>>>> Seriously, stop talking about kids, who cares, I'll be retired by the
>>>> time they're useful.  Programming languages are tools that are
>>>> primarily used by and useful for adults, they should be aimed at
>>>> adults.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Man, do you realize what you wrote here is incredibly out of place ? This
>>> is
>>> Squeak-dev here, Squeak has been involved with education and children
>>> since
>>> its beginnings, we have EToys, Scratch, OLPC. My own children use it. If
>>> you
>>> want a cultural revolution, ok, but first gather your troops, and let us
>>> count them.
>>>
>>> There's definitely a need to have everybody explicit their view of what
>>> it
>>> Squeak, me repeat again... surprises could be ahead.
>>>
>>>
>>> Stef
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Rita Freudenberg
> FIN-ISG
> Otto-von-Guericke-Universität Magdeburg
> http://isgwww.cs.uni-magdeburg.de/isg/rita.html
>
>
>