On Mon, Sep 15, 2014 at 12:31 PM, Craig Latta <craig at netjam.org> wrote:

>
> > ...one real problem with the Squeak/Pharo UI is the lack of native
> > windows.  There is an old project Graphics-External-Ffenestri but
> > AFAICT it isn't being used.
>
>      I'm using it, on Mac OS so far (Windows and Ubuntu Linux are the
> other host platforms I care about at the moment).
>
> > But there /is/ a really good prototype of a native window system
> > above Squeak done by Vassili Bykov in Newspeak.
>
>      Hoooold on there... :)  Does this mean that Vassili tried Ffenestri
> and found it unusable? If so, why? Details, please.
>

I don't want to talk for Vassili, but he had done the prototype for
Pollock, the new window system for VW that was squandered by Cincom
management.  In this he architected full conversion between native and
non-native windows, both dynamically and over snapshot.  So when he came to
implement the GUI for Newspeak he used that experience.  I don't see the
same architectural support in  Graphics-External-Ffenestri it doesn't even
support snapshot and resume on the same window system.  Here's the relevant
extract from HostWIndowProxy's class comment:

"This is a proxy for a Host OS window and as such is considered a
disposable item. When an image is restarted the client must recreate
suitable instances from the information they hold."

So I expect Vassili didn't even think of using it.  Vassili's work doesn't
need any VM support beyond the ability to ask the VM to /not/ respond to
GUI events.  It is based on the FFI and uses callbacks to receive events.
 In any case Vassili's work is the best candidate that I've ever seen for a
proper native windows integration for Smalltalk systems that ave a history
of non-native windows.


     thanks,
>
> -C
>
> --
> Craig Latta
> netjam.org
> +31 6 2757 7177 (SMS ok)
> + 1 415 287 3547 (no SMS)
>
>
>


-- 
best,
Eliot
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