[squeak-dev] The Inbox: Traits-pre.307.mcz

Tobias Pape Das.Linux at gmx.de
Mon Nov 23 15:57:05 UTC 2015


Hi Karl,

On 23.11.2015, at 16:45, karl ramberg <karlramberg at gmail.com> wrote:

> Software is hard to make. Even harder to make right.
> Picking up other peoples projects can be daunting.
> 
> Most of these projects are quite difficult and involve almost as much political as technical skills to do. (Political in the sense as to get the community to agree to changes and adapt)
> 
> I'm not sure how to proceed.
> 

I have to concur, for every very line.

We should have at least a list of things that people/community think are orphaned… so that we can bail if they are actually not.

Best regards
	-Tobias

> Best,
> Karl
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Nov 23, 2015 at 3:30 PM, Frank Shearar <frank.shearar at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 20 November 2015 at 18:40, tim Rowledge <tim at rowledge.org> wrote:
> > Should we keep Traits? It was a neat idea that I was happy to support but it got left unfinished. Where are tools to develop & manage Traits? Where is the usage?
> >
> > Unless there is a compelling reason - and subsequent effort to fill out support - I suggest we should remove them. Along with Islands. And Universes. And probably Environments too, since that has stalled without becoming a proper part of the system.
> 
> There's definitely a pattern there: someone has a great idea for a
> fairly advanced capability, heroically tries to do all the work solo,
> or with minimal help from the community, burns out and the work never
> gets finished.
> 
> Traits, or things close enough to traits that you end up splitting
> hairs to tell them apart, are a core feature of so many languages
> nowadays (Ruby, Newspeak, Scala, Perl 6, Rust, off the top of my
> head), while we let the idea die on the vine, for want of tooling
> support. And I'm sure Environments will, too.
> 
> Sure, if it's not providing value, and no one's willing to do the
> work, just kill the thing and be done. I'd rather see people pitch in
> and help _make_ the dang thing a proper part of the system. ("Thing"
> here applies mostly to Environments, but Islands and Traits too.) But
> I'm also not going to run around pointing fingers: I'm too burned out
> to do anything to help, so I'll just shut up now.
> 
> frank
> 
> > tim
> > --
> > tim Rowledge; tim at rowledge.org; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
> > Strange OpCodes: IG: Insert Garbage
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> 



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