Hi all,

On Thu, May 31, 2018 at 10:57 AM H. Hirzel <hannes.hirzel at gmail.com> wrote:

> John, I agree with you.
>
> Before thinking about a All-In-One which might cover the Mac as well
>
> there needs to be an stand-alone installation package for 5.2 (VM,
> sources, changes, image)
>
> for the Mac which actually runs ......
>

We recently discussed the necessity of a read-only DMG bundle for macOS
which solves this issue. And I've actually implemented that already (e.g.
[1]).
Thing is, we cannot provide a DMG for the All-In-One nor is there an easy
way around the sandbox disaster on macOS.
However, we should probably extend the read-only warning in Squeak when
running on macOS and instruct users to move the .app bundle before opening
it.

Fabio

[1]
http://files.squeak.org/5.2alpha/Squeak5.2alpha-18028-32bit/Squeak5.2alpha-18028-32bit-201804030952-macOS.dmg


>
> H.
>
> On 5/31/18, John Pfersich <smalltalker2 at mac.com> wrote:
> > Well, at least on Mac OS, the fact that Squeak doesn’t work right off the
> > bat is probably a turnoff for most users, especially since there don’t
> seem
> > to be any instructions on what to after you get this (I just tested
> this):
> >
> >
> > I mean, it's a 32 bit app (running on Mac OS 10.13.4) and you can't save
> the
> > image. What good is it? It's worse than non-functional. It seems to me
> that
> > a lot of people would just give up on it. I'm still running 4.6 because
> at
> > least it works on Mac OS without having to screw around, trying to figure
> > out what does work. And doing things not related to programming is what
> the
> > small Squeak community obviously wants beginners to do. If Squeak was a
> so
> > hard to use back in 2000, I would have abandoned it immediately.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On May 31, 2018, at 12:24 AM, "H. Hirzel" <hannes.hirzel at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > On 5/31/18, John Pfersich <smalltalker2 at mac.com> wrote:
> > I think the AIO causes more problems than it’s worth. Does it work in
> > Windows better than it does in Mac OS and Linux? I hope so, because it
> only
> > works for rank beginners on the latter platforms.
> >
> > This is the question of the target user group.
> >
> > As Bert mentions Etoys-to-go on a pen drive (use your environment in
> > school, e.g. Mac and at home Windows-PC) _is_ an issue. But as I just
> > write in the previous mail probably it has to be put on the
> > back-burner at the moment ....
> >
> > The user group of "beginners" is also the one which is the largest
> > group of users!
> >
> >
> > /————————————————————/
> > Encrypted email at jgpfersich at protonmail.com
> > Web: http://www.objectnets.net and http://www.objectnets.org
> >
> > On May 30, 2018, at 07:59, Tobias Pape <Das.Linux at gmx.de> wrote:
> >
> > HI
> >
> > On 30.05.2018, at 15:30, H. Hirzel <hannes.hirzel at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Chris Muller
> > Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 3:14 AM
> >
> > AIO provides a compact example file of everything needed to deploy an
> > application on each of the top platforms. For no more than its
> > instructional value, it is something worth keeping, IMO.
> >
> >
> > The AIO _is_ the application. Good to run off a pen drive as well in a
> > platform independent way.
> >
> > It does not need to be built regularily.
> > Just for the release is fine.
> >
> >
> > But the AIO is impractical.
> > Eg, for OSX we _must_ force users now to _move_ the .app bundle before
> > starting it the first time, else things just do not work. The only viable
> > Way I see for that is building read-only disk images, so that people must
> > move the app.
> >
> > However, nobody else can use DMGs, so we have two things already:
> > - ZIP
> > - DMG
> >
> > And now that snaps (https://snapcraft.io/) enter the stage for linux, we
> > have at least to _consider_ that, too.
> >
> > And when signing comes into play, this is getting too complex for me.
> >
> > I completely the understand the desirability of a portable app, but given
> > we;re not a near-stateless browser and given our "workforce", I don't see
> > this happen reliably in the forthcoming time.
> >
> > Best regards
> > -Tobias
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 5/30/18, David T. Lewis <lewis at mail.msen.com> wrote:
> > On Wed, May 30, 2018 at 07:22:28AM +0200, Tobias Pape wrote:
> >
> > On 30.05.2018, at 01:40, Edgar De Cleene <edgardec2005 at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > On 29 May 2018, at 15:42, karl ramberg <karlramberg at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Making it easier to find and download new VM builds should be a
> > priority.
> > It's quite hard to find a recent VM following links from squeak.org
> >
> > This scared beginners
> > All in one should have the most stable and recent
> >
> > Let's face it: the All-in-ones are dead.
> > Apple makes it harder than ever and for linux we should have start
> > building platform packages long ago.
> >
> >
> > This topic deserves a new subject line, and it would be great to get
> > some
> > more input regarding who prefers using the All-In-One distribution for
> > regular use, versus other approaches for organizing their image and VM.
> >
> > My personal view is that the All-In-One is a valuable enhancement to
> > the basic image and VM downloads. I do not think that it is practical
> > to maintain it as the primary release artifact, but I do think that we
> > should provide it, as best we can, in addition to the primary image and
> > VM release downloads.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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