[squeak-dev] Download of latest version of Loke/BabyIDE image? (was Re: A Sad Day ??? concluded)

Fabio Niephaus lists at fniephaus.com
Fri Nov 6 14:51:54 UTC 2020


Hi Dave,

On Fri, Nov 6, 2020 at 3:46 AM David T. Lewis <lewis at mail.msen.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Fabio,
>
> CC Squeak oversight board who I expect will support this enthusiastically.
>
> If you could put the BabyIDE-2019.07.23.zip file from Trygve's site on
> http://files.squeak.org site, that would be great.
>
> I would suggest saving it as:
>
>   http://files.squeak.org/various_images/BabyIDE/BabyIDE-2019.07.23.zip
>
> Also, the zip file contains a README.txt so it might be a good idea to
> save that README.txt file in the same folder with the zip.

Done! I've also added BabyIDE to the project list on squeak.org:
https://squeak.org/projects/

Fabio

>
> I don't know that Trygve is a git user, but I'll try to help with a pull
> request to tie this into our squeak.org site.
>
> Thanks very much for your help,
>
> Dave
>
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 04, 2020 at 11:18:08PM +0100, Fabio Niephaus wrote:
> > On Wed, 4 Nov 2020 at 9:28 pm, Trygve Reenskaug <trygver at ifi.uio.no> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > > I downloaded it to Mendeley because this should be a safe haven for data.
> > > It was accepted, given a DOI and published. Somebody low down in the
> > > Mendeley hierarchy has decided it is not a valid data set after all. They
> > > have broken my agreement with them and removed it  without informing me.
> > > This is now an ongoing discussion.
> > >
> > > Here's is a version of the BabyIDE zip:
> > >
> > > http://heim.ifi.uio.no/trygver/assets/BabyIDE-2019.07.23.zip
> > >
> > > It may not be identical to the published version, but should be very close.
> > > I have also finished a user guide for the image, I'll probably just make
> > > it an attachment to a squeak-Dev message.
> > >
> > > *How do I make files available on the Squeak web site?*
> > >
> >
> > Hi Trygve,
> >
> > Our website is on GitHub [1] and we accept pull requests. I'm part of the
> > Squeak web team and am happy to assist or upload files to our file server.
> >
> > Fabio
> >
> >
> > [1]
> > https://github.com/squeak-smalltalk/squeak.org
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Trygve
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2020-11-04 16:41, H. Hirzel wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello
> > >
> > > I was looking for the latest version of the
> > >
> > > Loke/BabyIDE image
> > >
> > > at https://data.mendeley.com/datasets/5xxgzv7fsp/1
> > >
> > > The image is my program repository. It includes some examples of DCI
> > > programming, Ellen's Personal Programming IDE, Squeak Reverse
> > > Engineering
> > > (SRE), and more.)
> > >
> > > It is no longer available at this mendeley url as it is not a dataset
> > > but a program.
> > > Could somebody who has downloaded it please make it available on the
> > > squeak web site?
> > >
> > > Thank you
> > > Regards
> > > Hannes
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 10/4/20, David T. Lewis <lewis at mail.msen.com> <lewis at mail.msen.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Thank you Trygve,
> > >
> > > I confirm also that the image runs very well on my Ubuntu Linux laptop
> > > with a VM compiled per http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/6354.
> > >
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > On Sat, Oct 03, 2020 at 07:56:43PM +0900, masato sumi wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Trygve,
> > >
> > > I confirmed that I could launch the Loke/BabyIDE image with the included
> > > SqueakVM for Windows (8.1 and 10)
> > > and I could also launch it in a web browser by using the SqueakJS VM (https://squeak.js.org/run ).
> > >
> > > Thank you very much.
> > >
> > > --
> > > sumim
> > >
> > > 2020-10-03 15:48 Trygve Reenskaug <trygver at ifi.uio.no> <trygver at ifi.uio.no>:
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear Sumim,
> > > Thank you for your kind words.
> > >
> > > The latest version of Loke/BabyIDE written on Squeak3.10.2 is athttps://data.mendeley.com/datasets/5xxgzv7fsp/1
> > > The image is my program repository. It includes some examples of DCI
> > > programming, Ellen's Personal Programming IDE, Squeak Reverse
> > > Engineering
> > > (SRE), and more.
> > >
> > > Best
> > > --Trygve
> > >
> > > On 2020-10-02 20:14, masato sumi wrote:
> > >
> > > Dear Trygve,
> > >
> > > Thank you for your very long term contribution and efforts.
> > >
> > > I'm very sorry that I couldn't help you at all now.
> > >
> > > I'm afraid, but could you please make your latest version of
> > > Loke/BabyIDE
> > > written on Squeak3.10.2 available for future generations of researchers
> > > and/or followers?
> > >
> > > Anyway, I think your ideas and thoughts should be passed on to future
> > > generations as faithfully as we can possible, and I myself will try to
> > > make
> > > sure that.
> > >
> > > Thank you so much and goodbye.
> > > Please take care of yourself.
> > >
> > > --
> > > sumim
> > >
> > > 2020-10-03 0:54 Trygve Reenskaug <trygver at ifi.uio.no> <trygver at ifi.uio.no>:
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear all,
> > > I need to use many words to explore why I can't understand current
> > > Squeak
> > > code. I believe the reason is a profound one, and I hope some of you
> > > have
> > > the patience to read about it.
> > >
> > > Thank you for your responses to my 'A Sad Day'-message. One response
> > > said
> > >  "*But please don't give up as an inventor of MVC, which has simplified
> > > writing software for all of us.*
> > >
> > >
> > > *We need new ideas to stabilize Smalltalk." *As to MVC, it was received
> > > with acclamation when I first presented it at PARC in 1978, and people
> > > suggested I should make it the theme of my article in the special
> > > Smalltalk
> > > issue of Byte. I couldn't understand it; MVC was so simple and obvious
> > > that
> > > is was not worth writing about it. Nevertheless, people seem to have
> > > problems understanding MVC. It took me a long time before I gleaned
> > > what
> > > was going on. The explanation is a deep one, rooted in our different
> > > mental
> > > paradigms.
> > >
> > > From around 1970, I was working on Prokon, a distributed system for
> > > managers in the shipbuilding industry:
> > >
> > >  Every manager has their own computer that they use for augmenting
> > > their
> > > mind. The manager understands their software and ideally writes it
> > > themselves. Managers delegate conversations with other managers to
> > > their
> > > computer's M-to-M network. (Marked with a heavy black line in the
> > > figure).
> > > I chose "distributed planning with central control" as my example
> > > project.
> > > Each manager creates a plan for their department, using apps suited to
> > > their particular needs. A **distributed algorithm** ensures consistency
> > > across departments.
> > >
> > > I came to PARC in 1978 and could immediately relate to the Smalltalk
> > > image with its universe of collaborating objects. Alan's definition of
> > > object-orientation fitted my Prokon model: "Thus its semantics are a
> > > bit
> > > like having thousands and thousands of computers all hooked together by
> > > a
> > > very fast network."
> > >
> > > MVC prescribes a network of communicating objects. Any object can fill
> > > one or more positions in the network as long as it has the required
> > > behavior; their classes are irrelevant. It's so simple that it's not
> > > worth
> > > writing about it.
> > >
> > >
> > > ====================
> > >
> > > The work on this post was interrupted at this point by an unexpected
> > > week
> > > in hospital. It gave me quiet days of pondering the futility of what I
> > > am
> > > doing and I will be terminating my memberships in the Pharo and Squeak
> > > mailing lists. I have also deleted most of the old draft of this
> > > message
> > > and will quickly conclude with two observations:
> > >
> > >
> > >    1.
> > >    The Smalltalk image is a universe of communicating objects. I call
> > > it
> > >    an object computer. It can be seen as the model of an entirely new
> > > kind of
> > >    computer, a model on a level closer to the human mind than the von
> > > Neumann
> > >    model of 1948. The new model is communication-centric and should
> > > supersede
> > >    the ubiquitous CPU-centric model as soon as possible. Working out
> > > the
> > >    details of this idea could make an exciting and disruptive Ph.D.
> > > thesis.
> > >    2.
> > >    Smalltalk is called a programming language. It is a curious one,
> > > very
> > >    different from well-known languages like Java with their syntax and
> > >    semantics. Smalltalk, as a programming language, does not have the
> > > concept
> > >    of a program. Smalltalk, as a class-oriented language, does not have
> > > syntax
> > >    for the declaration of a class. Smalltalk, as an object-oriented
> > > language,
> > >    can't describe how objects collaborate to achieve a goal. You appear
> > > to be
> > >    happy with this state of affairs, at least, I see no sign of anybody
> > >    wanting to move on from the unfinished Smalltalk language to a
> > > mature
> > >    development environment. I do not find it satisfactory and it is not
> > >    acceptable to the intended managers populating the distributed
> > > system shown
> > >    in the first picture. Consequently, I have done something about it
> > > as
> > >    described in my SoSym article "*Personal Programming and the Object
> > >    Computer.*" I am tired of being alone in my endeavors and this ends
> > >    my work with Squeak and other Smalltalks. I wish you health and
> > > happiness
> > >    wherever you happen to be.
> > >
> > > Trygve
> > > Personal programming and the object computerhttps://doi.org/10.1007/s10270-019-00768-3
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > *The essence of object orientation is that objects collaborate  to
> > > achieve a goal. *
> > > Trygve Reenskaug      mailto: trygver at ifi.uio.no<%20trygver at ifi.uio.no> <%20trygver at ifi.uio.no>Morgedalsvn. 5A <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Morgedalsvn.+5A?entry=gmail&source=g>       http://folk.uio.no/trygver/
> > > N-0378 Oslo             http://fullOO.info
> > > Norway                     Tel: (+47) 468 58 625
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > *The essence of object orientation is that objects collaborate  to
> > > achieve
> > > a goal. *
> > > Trygve Reenskaug      mailto: trygver at ifi.uio.no <%20trygver at ifi.uio.no> <%20trygver at ifi.uio.no>Morgedalsvn. 5A <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Morgedalsvn.+5A?entry=gmail&source=g>       http://folk.uio.no/trygver/
> > > N-0378 Oslo             http://fullOO.info
> > > Norway                     Tel: (+47) 468 58 625
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > *The essence of object orientation is that objects collaborate  to achieve
> > > a goal. *
> > > Trygve Reenskaug      mailto: trygver at ifi.uio.no <%20trygver at ifi.uio.no>
> > > Morgedalsvn. 5A       http://heim.ifi.uio.no/trygver/
> > > N-0378 Oslo             http://fullOO.info
> > >
> > >
> > > Norway                     Tel: (+47) 468 58 625
> > >
> > >
>
> >
>
>


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