Here's another vote for proxies ensuring their own safety (e.g., 
with VM support), rather than making the image worry about "proxy 
safety". Proxies should be as transparent as we can make them. That's 
the point of them.


-C

***

      On 10 January 2022 at 04:18 pacific time, Thiede, Christoph wrote:

 > Hi Chris,
 >
 >
 > I am not sure whether we can (or should) make the default inspector
 > proxy-safe. Rather, IMHO the default inspectors should handle
 > proxies transparently and display the underlying object. For inspecting
 > the implementation details of proxies, we have the BasicInspector, which
 > is almost completely proxy-safe (the only exception I am aware of is a
 > send to #isReadOnlyObject for the window label, for which we currently
 > do not have a mirror primitive).
 >
 >
 >  > #size is a provoking message.
 >
 >
 > And #printString, #longPrintString, #perform:, #instVarNamed:,
 > #basicSize, and all others existing sends are not? :-)
 >
 >
 >> Magma's Proxy's anyway (which don't use the mirror-primitives but the
 > old-school Proxy pattern)
 >
 >
 > Just out of interest, how would you implement a proxy using mirror
 > primitives? :-)
 >
 >
 > Best,
 >
 > Christoph
 >
 > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
 > *Von:* Squeak-dev <squeak-dev-bounces at lists.squeakfoundation.org> im
 > Auftrag von Chris Muller <asqueaker at gmail.com>
 > *Gesendet:* Montag, 10. Januar 2022 02:34:00
 > *An:* squeak dev
 > *Betreff:* Re: [squeak-dev] The Inbox: Tools-ct.1101.mcz
 > Hi Christoph,
 >
 > I like the "Inspector" tools to be as rudimentary as possible so they
 > can be used with Proxy's better.  At least with Magma's Proxy's anyway
 > (which don't use the mirror-primitives but the old-school Proxy
 > pattern), when I have an instance of MyProxy I'm able to inspect it
 > without sending any provoking messages.  #size is a provoking message.
 >
 > Explorers and other more snappy tools, on the other hand, already have
 > no chance to use with Proxys, so might be good to see there.
 >
 >   - Chris
 >
 > On Mon, Jan 3, 2022 at 4:16 PM <commits at source.squeak.org
 > <mailto:commits at source.squeak.org>> wrote:
 >
 >     A new version of Tools was added to project The Inbox:
 >     http://source.squeak.org/inbox/Tools-ct.1101.mcz
 >     <http://source.squeak.org/inbox/Tools-ct.1101.mcz>
 >
 >     ==================== Summary ====================
 >
 >     Name: Tools-ct.1101
 >     Author: ct
 >     Time: 3 January 2022, 11:16:09.863397 pm
 >     UUID: 97ded064-e941-f744-ac9b-642118fe8ef5
 >     Ancestors: Tools-ct.1100
 >
 >     Proposal: Display the size of a collection in the window label.
 >
 >     =============== Diff against Tools-ct.1100 ===============
 >
 >     Item was added:
 >     + ----- Method: CollectionInspector>>labelString (in category 'user
 >     interface - window') -----
 >     + labelString
 >     +
 >     +       ^ '{1} ({2})' translated format: {super labelString. [self
 >     object size] ifError: ['?']}!

--
Craig Latta  ::  research computer scientist
Black Page Digital  ::  Berkeley, California
663137D7940BF5C0AFC :: 1349FB2ADA32C4D5314CE