[squeak-dev] The Trunk: Morphic-mt.1852.mcz

mail at jaromir.net mail at jaromir.net
Thu Jan 27 08:14:49 UTC 2022


Hi tim, Chris, all,

> > On 2022-01-26, at 3:27 PM, Chris Muller <asqueaker at gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > I believe there's a reason *Workspaces* shouldn't be able to save --
> > because if you're doing so much work that it should be saved, then it should be put into a method instead. 
> 
> I'd argue that there are bunches of doit-code/notes that you want to have safe and not in a method, and the right way to do that is with a fileeditor opened on the file. (tim)
> 

Yes, that's exactly right. Reading Chris's reply I started to suspect I'm using the Workspace for what it wasn't made for: I test various snippets in the Workspace and put down expectations, notes, results etc, to be copied to some document later. Checking standard menus I can't see any text editor - have I missed something important here? (I learn by myself so the clues in the system are crucial for me)

> > I just realized being able to save Workspaces opens this can of worms of needing a stale-detection system in any case -- otherwise users will face this "doubt" every single time they launch the image. (Chris)

Yes, true, I know this feeling very well :) That's why I like Marcel's idea to append the accepted contents to the saved file rather than overwrite; it's a backup anyway so when a disaster (or doubt) strikes one can check the backups.

thanks,
best,
~~~
^[^    Jaromir

Sent from Squeak Inbox Talk

On 2022-01-26T15:49:44-08:00, tim at rowledge.org wrote:

> I almost agree - 
> 
> > On 2022-01-26, at 3:27 PM, Chris Muller <asqueaker at gmail.com> wrote:
> > 
> > I believe there's a reason *Workspaces* shouldn't be able to save --
> > because if you're doing so much work that it should be saved, then it
> > should be put into a method instead.
> 
> I'd argue that there are bunches of doit-code/notes that you want to have safe and not in a method, and the right way to do that is with a fileeditor opened on the file.
> 
> I just recently made the FileList open a "Workspace with file saving ability" instead of a very hinky mashup of FileList parts, so at least one part is a smidge cleaner. What I'd urge is making it very clear that a window open on a backing file can save & re-load to/from that file, and that a not-backedup one cannot. And it's really not a difficult thing to arrange for a Workspace to turn into a FileEditor if/when a user chooses to ask for it. Nor would it be a terrible thing to have the option to choose which you get as a default.
> 
> But Chris has also just raised another important point about staleness and multiple-source editing of the workspace files. Beating that would require some'interesting' work to do constant auto-saving with the file having a full tagged edit history  in the vein of the Apple approach to Pages/Numbers/Keynote files. It's all a bit much for a simple text view with a good relationship with the compiler...
> 
> tim
> --
> tim Rowledge; tim at rowledge.org; http://www.rowledge.org/tim
> Fractured Idiom:- APRES MOE LE DELUGE - Larry and Curly get wet
> 
> 


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