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Craig,<br>
I appreciate your unpleasant situation - so many important ideas
waiting to be realized and nobody willing to pay your living expenses.
(I'm extremely fortunate, I get my pension and nobody asks me how I
spend my time). So, as I have said before. SPOON is too promising to be
stopped.<br>
<br>
More comments inline below.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 12.07.2007 22:36, Craig Latta wrote:
<blockquote cite="midf763dc$3k1$1@sea.gmane.org" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Hi--
Trygve writes:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">The idea of "burn the disk packs" was a fundamental mistake; it
doesn't take into account that the value of a release image is
minuscule compared to the value added by user/programmers. The idea of
a personal computer cannot be reconciled with the idea of throwing
everything away every few years. What about my address book, my diary,
the useful program I wrote two years ago, the program I'm working on
now. (My programs are part of my personal data)
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Well, I wasn't asking anyone to throw anything away. I was asking
for planning. Continuity is actually very important to me. Indeed, if it
weren't, I wouldn't have taken the tactic of changing Squeak into what I
want; I would have made something completely new. I'm also putting a lot
of work into paths from current Squeak to Spoon (e.g., adapting my VM
and remote browsing changes to Squeak 3.9).
</pre>
</blockquote>
We agree on this point. I'm afraid I was riding a hobby horse here.<br>
<blockquote cite="midf763dc$3k1$1@sea.gmane.org" type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I am afraid you expect too much from the community.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
It seems so.
</pre>
</blockquote>
May be the community expects too much from you, too. When I tried to
start SPOON a the end of May, I followed your instructions to "view the
current _installed modules", but got an error. When I reported it, you
answered "Great, you got as far as trying that! <span
class="moz-smiley-s1"><span> :) </span></span> Those things don't
actually work in that release, stay tuned for the next release." I may
be naive, but I did not expect you to invite me to spend my time on
things that just cannot work.<br>
<blockquote cite="midf763dc$3k1$1@sea.gmane.org" type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I am working on my own pet project(s). Like everyone else, I am trying
to avoid committing /error 33: Predicating one research effort upon
the success of another.
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/E/error-33.html">http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/E/error-33.html</a>)
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
Ah, but I think we take that too far and commit error 34 (insisting
upon small incremental changes *at all times*) and error 35 (being
unwilling to imagine a way to achieve larger changes in the future). I
think these are much worse than error 33, and as an exquisite case in
point I present the very origin of that term, Xerox PARC. :)
</pre>
</blockquote>
I know error 33 came from PARC; I was there. But you misunderstand it.
It leaves you free to reinvent the world, but warns me about
prematurely building on your results. I do not insist on small
incremental changes. That is precisely why I hope for a usable SPOON,
an environment for new and fundamental changes that can co-exist with
the old.<br>
<blockquote cite="midf763dc$3k1$1@sea.gmane.org" type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Still, I do want to try SPOON. But I got wary when I followed the
installation directions and immediately crashed. Perhaps the project
hasn't got as far as I expected.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap=""><!---->
It is indeed alpha software currently, as marked. Still, I hadn't
thought that would keep people from considering possibilities.
</pre>
</blockquote>
You first have to give me something to consider...<span
class="moz-smiley-s1"><span> :-) </span></span>
<pre wrap="">Cheers
--Trygve
</pre>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Trygve Reenskaug mailto: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:trygver@ifi.uio.no">trygver@ifi.uio.no</a>
Morgedalsvn. 5A <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://folk.uio.no/trygver">http://folk.uio.no/trygver</a>
N-0378 Oslo Tel: (+47) 22 49 57 27
Norway
</pre>
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