<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2009/4/20 Matej Kosik <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kosik@fiit.stuba.sk">kosik@fiit.stuba.sk</a>></span><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
José Luis Redrejo wrote:<br>
><br>
><br>
> 2009/4/20 Matej Kosik <<a href="mailto:kosik@fiit.stuba.sk">kosik@fiit.stuba.sk</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:kosik@fiit.stuba.sk">kosik@fiit.stuba.sk</a>>><br>
<div><div></div><div class="h5">><br>
> Bert Freudenberg wrote:<br>
> ><br>
> > On 19.04.2009, at 23:57, Matej Kosik wrote:<br>
> ><br>
> >> Bert Freudenberg wrote:<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> On 19.04.2009, at 22:20, Matej Kosik wrote:<br>
> >>>><br>
> >>>> Are there any versions of Squeak images that could be imported to<br>
> >>>> Debian<br>
> >>>> repositories? (some minimal images with sorted out licencing<br>
> issues).<br>
> >>><br>
> >>><br>
> >>> Not exactly minimal, but license-clean:<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> <a href="http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/etoys/" target="_blank">http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/glucose/etoys/</a><br>
> >><br>
> >> I have looked at it (btw. Jose already created and registered<br>
> >> appropriate package---cool). Is it possible to somehow open a<br>
> browser,<br>
> >> workspace and such? (in that image)?<br>
> ><br>
> > It's not really meant for Smalltalk development, but you can press<br>
> > alt-shift-w to get the full world menu.<br>
><br>
> The two images:<br>
> - etoys<br>
> - etoys-dev<br>
> would fit to the Lex's scheme<br>
> <a href="http://ftp.squeak.org/debian/squeak-on-debian.pdf" target="_blank">http://ftp.squeak.org/debian/squeak-on-debian.pdf</a><br>
> I think, that whatever Jose wanted to achieve with his separate<br>
> squeak-vm package can be achieved also with our squeak-vm package (now<br>
> they are different).<br>
><br>
> What would be the advantage?<br>
> - We could keep our rich repository:<br>
> <a href="http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/3616" target="_blank">http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/3616</a><br>
> That contains also "licence unclean" packages.<br>
> - Some of those packages could be posted to Debian<br>
> - etoys<br>
> - etoys-dev<br>
> Really, people could then:<br>
><br>
> apt-get install etoys<br>
><br>
> and run it as:<br>
><br>
> etoys<br>
><br>
> - We would not have to maintain two (three, four, ...)<br>
> separate squeak-vm package versions.<br>
><br>
> How does this sound to Lex and especially to Jose?<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> I'm afraid I don't understand what you mean.<br>
<br>
</div></div>Having two separate squeak-vm packages (yours and ours) is, by default,<br>
a nonsense. Unless there is a reason for it. Is there a reason?<br>
<br>
Cannot we create a single squeak-vm package that would work both, for<br>
you (etoys) and for us (packages published on Squeak wiki)?<br>
</blockquote><div><br><br>The package currently in Debian should work with the image packages published on Squeak wiki. I've not tested it, but as far as I know, you use the same directories as I use, they work.<br>
<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><br>
Are our goals (concerning what squeak-vm package should provide)<br>
mutually exclusive?<br>
<br>
Squeak-vm package must be maintained by someone, who actually also<br>
understands the source code and can solve possible minor problems. I am<br>
not such a person.<br>
<br>
I could ask in another way: cannot your goals be achieved by taking our<br>
squeak-vm package and updating it? If not, why?<br></blockquote></div><br>Not, because:<br>a) your package doesn't have desktop integration<br>b) your package is developer friendly, not user friendly. A terminal is needed to choose between the installed images. The package in Debian show a zenity dialog (I've also added a kdialog if kde is used, but not uploaded that change to Debian yet) to choose the images, so the user doesn't need to launch a terminal and write some unix commands to get the image loaded.<br>
c) your package compiles the MPEG3Plugin that can not be in Debian due to patents problems.<br>d) If you take a look at <a href="http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/s/squeak-vm/squeak-vm_3.10.3+svn1902.dfsg-1/changelog">http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/s/squeak-vm/squeak-vm_3.10.3+svn1902.dfsg-1/changelog</a> you can also see that I have added some patches to fix bugs that were not fixed in the official sources when I did the package. Most of them are fixed updtream today <br>
<pre><br></pre><br>Maybe, the question can be: cannot your goals be achieved by taking the squeak-vm package available in Debian? if not, why?<br>Please, don't misunderstand me, I'm totally open to change the package , but points a) and b) are really important for me. While the <a href="http://squeak.org">squeak.org</a> package doesn't have those features, I'm not going to take backwards my users. Point c) is a must inside Debian.<br>
<br>About the etoys package in Debian, the only difference between the package in Debian and the package in the olpc site is that Debian one is a deb instead of a rpm. Appart of that, they are exactly the same.<br><br>Regards.<br>
José L.<br>