<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:arial, helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12pt"><div><span>thank you both for your replies, I registred in source.squeak and I am waiting for the approval. Regarding latest image , isn't squeak update (Squeak main memu) capable of updating to the latest ? I like the inbox idea, this way I can feel safe that I wont mess anything up. </span></div><div><span><br></span></div><div>Is there a guideline of documenting classes (html link , article , pdf etc) ? </div><div><br></div> <div style="font-family: arial, helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; "> <div style="font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; font-size: 12pt; "> <div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> <hr size="1"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Frank Shearar-3 [via Smalltalk] <ml-node+s1294792n4644525h48@n4.nabble.com><br> <b><span style="font-weight:
bold;">To:</span></b> kilon <thekilon@yahoo.co.uk> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Saturday, 18 August 2012, 14:00<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: How may I contribute in documenting classes ?<br> </font> </div> <br><div id="yiv285004836">
On 18 August 2012 08:29, dimitris chloupis <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>> wrote:
<div class="yiv285004836shrinkable-quote"><br>> I am using squeak, I am learning it and I am loving it. I know its not
<br>> perfect, I know it has it faults , but I feel I finally found an enviroment
<br>> that I can do what I always want "live coding"
<br>>
<br>> As you can imagine as a begineer I spent a lot of time in system browser and
<br>> I am suprised by the lack of documentation to some basic classes. Now I am
<br>> probably the last person to qualify as a person to document those classes
<br>> since my experience is very limited with Squeak and smalltalk. But I feel
<br>> that some documentation even if its a partial one , is better than no
<br>> documentation. And since I am already reading so much of the souce , why not
<br>> save people's time and mine (I can foget easily the code I read and so a
<br>> documentation string can help me remember) by adding documentation strings
<br>> to classes and their methods.
<br>>
<br>> The only things I dont know is how to make those documentations port back to
<br>> squeak standard distribution. I assume would need some commit rights to the
<br>> squeak source ?
</div><br>I wholeheartedly agree that there are a whole pile of things in the
<br>base image desperately needing comments. Your commits will be most
<br>welcome!
<br><br>Add your class comments, and use Monticello to save your edited
<br>packages (as shown in the Monticello Browser) to the Inbox.
<br><br>I don't have an image close at hand, but you should have the Inbox as
<br>one of the repositories in the right hand pane of the Monticello
<br>Browser. (If it's not there, we ought to add it as part of the
<br>standard released image, so let me know.) If it's not there, right
<br>click the "trunk" repository, select "edit repository info" and copy
<br>that chunk of text. Cancel the dialog, and press the "+ Repository"
<br>button. Paste in the text, and change "trunk" to "inbox".
<br><br>Sometimes when you select the package you want to save you don't see
<br>the repository you want to push to in the right hand pane. I often
<br>find it easier to just save the package to my package-cache repository
<br>and, from the version browser that pops up, just Copy the version to
<br>whichever repo I want.
<br><br>Once it's in the Inbox, the core devs can have a look at the class
<br>comment, review it, ask you to change some things if necessary, and
<br>they'll take care of pushing the comments into the Trunk.
<br><br>frank
<br><div class="yiv285004836shrinkable-quote"><br>> ________________________________
<br>> From: dimitris chloupis <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>
<br>> To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
<br>> <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>
<br>> Sent: Saturday, 18 August 2012, 10:09
<br>> Subject: Re: [squeak-dev] Why FFI is not included with latest squeak ?
<br>>
<br>> First thank you all for your answers. Suffice to say I have installed FFI
<br>> from source.squeak , Win32 refuses to install for me(I am on MacoOSX if that
<br>> is of any importance [Lion]).
<br>>
<br>> The argument that "we dont include FFI because we dont want to encourage
<br>> people to use it instead of smalltalk" is something that does not convince
<br>> me. FFIs exist included in implementations of all languages I have
<br>> programmed with Python , Java, Common lisp (ccl) , Free Pascal etc . I was a
<br>> python developer so far, ctypes which is the interface of python itself is
<br>> used exactly because ( though its way slower than writing C extensions ) it
<br>> allows coders to stick with python and make code easier to port across
<br>> platforms. In my experience coders dont use FFIs just for the fun for it,
<br>> because they are not fun , they can be a pain in the hat. Also a coder
<br>> preferring FFI from the comfort of the amazing smalltalk debugger is
<br>> something I have a very hard time imagining. People use FFIs because well ,
<br>> they want to acess a functionality that the existing libraries just do not
<br>> offer and that functionality exist on OS level anyway that will require some
<br>> mangling with C. So no I dont think FFI will ever reduce the portability of
<br>> squeak or that FFI libraries will start to pop up like mushrooms.
<br>>
<br>> Its not such an issue for me because : a) I can provide an image that will
<br>> have FFI included b) unlike python squeak distribution system (monitcello)
<br>> not only does not suck but seems to work quite well.
<br>>
<br>> " Many applications do not need FFI" that could be said for a lot of
<br>> smalltalk libraries already included with squeak. For example I have not
<br>> seen many apps in squeak source make use of etoys ( I love etoys by the way
<br>> and one of the reason I prefer Squeak from Pharo and is potentially
<br>> necessary for a project I am making). I dont think that is a good excuse as
<br>> well. Libraries dont need to be super popular to be included in a language
<br>> implementations they are included to offer a more "complete" experience to
<br>> the code as long they provide "basic" functionality and not something that
<br>> is highly specialised.
<br>>
<br>> In any case I asked the question not because I want to force the inclusion
<br>> of FFIs but because its the first time in last decade or so that I use a
<br>> language implementation that does not come included with an FFI and tham
<br>> made me curious about the reason behind this. In any case I love what you
<br>> have done with Squeak, I really enjoy using it and even though it lacks
<br>> documentation in several areas it really is easy to understand what is going
<br>> on because of the overall architecture and the elegance of tools like
<br>> inspector, and browser. Let me state all the above is my personal opinion
<br>> and not an effort to play it smart or being rude, just geniune curiosity.
<br>>
<br>> ________________________________
<br>> From: Bert Freudenberg <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>
<br>> To: "<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>" <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>; The general-purpose
<br>> Squeak developers list <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>
<br>> Cc: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
<br>> <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>>
<br>> Sent: Friday, 17 August 2012, 21:21
<br>> Subject: Re: [squeak-dev] Why FFI is not included with latest squeak ?
<br>>
<br>> On 16.08.2012, at 22:28, Chris Muller <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>> wrote:
<br>>
<br>>> Many applications do not need FFI, so it including would add
<br>>> unnecessary (in many cases) bits to the footprint.
<br>>>
<br>>> FFI is a one-click install from SqueakMap, which can be accessed
<br>>> programmatically via the Installer class, which is included with
<br>>> Squeak.
<br>>>
<br>>> HTH.
<br>>
<br>> Right. Also, if we included it by default, people might think it is okay to
<br>> use for providing basic functions. If FFI calls started to creep into the
<br>> basic image we would lose the big advantage of platform independence.
<br>>
<br>> - Bert -
<br>>
<br>>>
<br>>> On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 12:16 PM, kilon <<a rel="nofollow" href="">[hidden email]</a>> wrote:
<br>>>> I was wondering why I need to install FFI and why it is not included by
<br>>>> default. Any programming language I have used included at least a single
<br>>>> FFI
<br>>>> with it in its implementations or at least something similar.
<br>>>>
<br>>>> Is there a specfic reason why its not included ?
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>>
<br>>>> --
<br>>>> View this message in context:
<br>>>> <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://forum.world.st/Why-FFI-is-not-included-with-latest-squeak-tp4644264.html">http://forum.world.st/Why-FFI-is-not-included-with-latest-squeak-tp4644264.html</a><br>>>> Sent from the Squeak - Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
<br>>>>
<br>>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
<br>>
</div><br>
<br>
<br>
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