<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Hi Karl,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">In my opinion there is no doubt the Etoys is inferior in power to pure text programming. But I suppose that was never an objective, since, for example in the Etoys variables you can't use Collections. What could you do in Smalltalk without Collections? ;)</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Maybe with time I will realize Etoys is hopeless too, but for the moment I find it kind of cool. I am going to spend a bit more time exploring it. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">bye</div><div class="">Nicola</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Oct 20, 2019, at 11:06 AM, karl ramberg <<a href="mailto:karlramberg@gmail.com" class="">karlramberg@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Menlo-Regular; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=""><div class="gmail_quote" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Menlo-Regular; font-size: 15px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Oct 20, 2019 at 7:19 PM K K Subbu <<a href="mailto:kksubbu.ml@gmail.com" class="">kksubbu.ml@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">Karl,<br class=""><br class="">I recall the tile-based scripting code was designed to introduce<br class="">programming concepts to young children (1-5th grade). The stage metaphor<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">(players, costumers, scripts, timing) are easy for them to understand.<br class=""><br class="">Once children are old enough to type and use keyboard, they can switch<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">over to using text and use the full power of Squeak.<br class=""><br class="">Not sure what you mean by "the premise is flawed". It works very well<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">for its intended audience.<br class=""></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I mean it's hard to program so to start tile scripting seems like a good idea.<br class=""></div><div class="">But the leverage you get from using tiles is surpassed within a few projects.</div><div class="">Anything more complex than 10 scripts or is really cumbersome.</div><div class="">Also any complex scripts are also hard to deal with. Text for this is far superior.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I'm sure tile scripting has its use but I'm not very motivated to develop and enhance<br class=""></div><div class="">etoys anymore. I used to do a lot of work for the Etoys image for OLPC.<br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Best,</div><div class="">Karl</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><br class="">Regards .. Subbu<br class=""><br class="">On 19/10/19 11:08 PM, karl ramberg wrote:<br class="">> I’m not working so much on tile scripting anymore<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> The main issue is scaleability of tile scripting in regards to writing<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> text scripts and programs. I have worked a lot with etoys and while I<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> find the concept appealing but I have yet to write anything project<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> bigger than a dozen scripts. I find it hard to build bigger stuff. Maybe<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> it’s tooling but my main suspicion is that the premise is flawed.<br class="">> Text is superior to tiles. Programming is really hard. Writing text<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> scales better than tiles because it is less rigid and easier to deal<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> with than tiles.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> Best,<br class="">> Karl<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> On Sat, 19 Oct 2019 at 05:32, Nicola Mingotti <<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> <mailto:<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> Hi Karl,<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> The feature is very promising.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> It would be more than useful, I think it would strike the<br class="">> imagination of new potential user if I/whoever would show it in a<br class="">> video.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> Consider this, in all other languages to keep an eye on a silly<br class="">> variable the fastest way is to print in stdout. This is something<br class="">> that Typing Joe did thousands of times.<br class="">> It is extremely ugly and messy. I keep printing in Transcript myself<br class="">> and I dislike it. I do only because it is fast to implement.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> If you are working on it let me know when you have reached a<br class="">> landmark. I may illustrate the feature in a new video.<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">> bye<br class="">> Nicola<br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">>> On Oct 18, 2019, at 12:55 PM, karl ramberg <<a href="mailto:karlramberg@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">karlramberg@gmail.com</a><br class="">>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:karlramberg@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">karlramberg@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br class="">>><br class="">>> Hi,<br class="">>> I understand what you talk about now :-)<br class="">>> This functionality is experimental. I think it was part of a plan<br class="">>> to make tile scripting more general but it never not finished.<br class="">>><br class="">>> Best,<br class="">>> Karl<br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>> On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 7:37 AM Nicola Mingotti<br class="">>> <<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><mailto:<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br class="">>><br class="">>> hi,<br class="">>><br class="">>> here is a video explaining the question<br class="">>><br class="">>> <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2wn9Yc7P2s&feature=youtu.be" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2wn9Yc7P2s&feature=youtu.be</a><br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>> bye<br class="">>> Nicola<br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>>> On Oct 17, 2019, at 9:49 AM, karl ramberg<br class="">>>> <<a href="mailto:karlramberg@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">karlramberg@gmail.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:karlramberg@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">karlramberg@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> Hi,<br class="">>>> I dom't really understand what you ask here.<br class="">>>> Could you send a screen shot or something ?<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> Best,<br class="">>>> Karl<br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>> On Thu, Oct 17, 2019 at 12:38 AM Nicola Mingotti<br class="">>>> <<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><mailto:<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>> Hi Marcel,<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> I understand more or less how to use the Viewer on Players.<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> Indeed, I was surprised when I saw that there is a Viewer<br class="">>>> for a Morph !<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> And I don't understand at all how this does fit into the<br class="">>>> big picture nor how to use it.<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> It would be very nice if I could drag out a line from the<br class="">>>> Viewer and keep a variable of the Morph under my eyes in<br class="">>>> the World, in a tile.<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> bye<br class="">>>> Nicola<br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>>> On Oct 16, 2019, at 1:40 AM, Marcel Taeumel<br class="">>>>> <<a href="mailto:marcel.taeumel@hpi.de" target="_blank" class="">marcel.taeumel@hpi.de</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:marcel.taeumel@hpi.de" target="_blank" class="">marcel.taeumel@hpi.de</a>>><br class="">>>>> wrote:<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>> > Is it normal that I don't see the variable value in<br class="">>>>> the Viewer window ?<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>> I think you need to click on "viewer for player".<br class="">>>>> Players can have scripts, which are constructed from<br class="">>>>> those tiles.<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>> Best,<br class="">>>>> Marcel<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Am 16.10.2019 00:14:23 schrieb Nicola Mingotti<br class="">>>>>> <<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a><mailto:<a href="mailto:nmingotti@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">nmingotti@gmail.com</a>>>:<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Hi,<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Please follow these steps:<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> 1] Drag a RectangleMorph into the World<br class="">>>>>> 2] Center click over it<br class="">>>>>> 3] Select the wrench Halo icon (gray one)<br class="">>>>>> 4] Select "Viewer for Morph"<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> I see a lot of properties which I usually control via<br class="">>>>>> the Workspace.<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Let's focus on "Rectangl Center".<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> My questions are:<br class="">>>>>> -] Is it normal that I don't see the variable value in<br class="">>>>>> the Viewer window ?<br class="">>>>>> -] It would be extremely useful if I could just drag<br class="">>>>>> out the ViewrMorphLine for "RectangleMorphCenter" into<br class="">>>>>> the World . So I could always check (in this case) the<br class="">>>>>> center of a Morph.<br class="">>>>>> -] More in general, I don't understand how I can use<br class="">>>>>> all of these tiles, can anybody give me some hints ?<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> bye<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Nicola Mingotti<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>>><br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">>><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>