<div dir="ltr"><div>Craig Latta has been developing similar stuff for a while with Spoon and other projects:</div><div><br></div><div> "... I’m working on my <a href="http://netjam.org/context">Context</a>
project, a distributed, modular, minimalist computer programming
system. It’s a distributed object system with a module system (“<a href="http://netjam.org/context/naiad">Naiad</a>“) and a minimal kernel (“Spoon”). "</div><div><br></div><div><a href="https://thiscontext.com/">https://thiscontext.com/</a></div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Karl</div><div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:56 AM Trygve Reenskaug <<a href="mailto:trygver@ifi.uio.no">trygver@ifi.uio.no</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
Just an idea while a car is waiting to take me on a vacation.<br>
<br>
Imagine:<br>
<ol>
<li>You have a computer with many independently running images.</li>
<li>A super fast facility pass messages between the images,</li>
<li>Selected services in the release image are move out and
deployed as server objects in another image.</li>
<li>Every image appears as a server offering RESTful interfaces to
other images.</li>
<li>Selected packages in any repository can be downloaded,
compiled, instantiated, and deployed in an image as server
objects.</li>
<li>The different images can even run in different computers and
use different VMs.<br>
</li>
<li>There are now two dimensions to the reuse of functionality: a)
download and compile a package. b In some image, install a
package and deploy it as a server object.</li>
<li>And presto: The original image is now small and manageable
while the whole system can grow without increasing the
complexity of the release image.</li>
</ol>
In haste. This is just an idea. It's full of holes and need a lot of
work done to it before it can be usable.. It's a disruptive idea, so
please give it some consideration This is before you shoot it down<br>
--Trygve<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 2020-08-14 22:54, karl ramberg
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Well said, Vanessa :-)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The complexity comes from people using Squeak and wanting
to improve it in many directions.</div>
<div>And managing code , graphics , user interface , faster
virtual machine, networking, security etc. are hard problems
which add complexity. <br>
</div>
<div>And also the added accidental complexity on top of that.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It seems systems only are simple and elegant until people
start using them.</div>
<div>One can see that as a good or bad thing.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Solution to the complexity problem will probably take a few
generations to solve...<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Best,</div>
<div>Karl<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 9:42
PM Vanessa Freudenberg <<a href="mailto:vanessa@codefrau.net" target="_blank">vanessa@codefrau.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 2:31 AM Marcel
Taeumel <<a href="mailto:marcel.taeumel@hpi.de" target="_blank">marcel.taeumel@hpi.de</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div id="gmail-m_-7709603499140783315gmail-m_-1932263044885793122gmail-m_3789850793272140994__MailbirdStyleContent" style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial;color:rgb(0,0,0)"> Hi Trygve,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I apologize for any misunderstandings here. <span style="font-size:10pt">I am not an English native
speaker. It was not my intent do accuse you of
lying.</span></div>
<div><span style="font-size:10pt"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span style="font-size:10pt">However, there is a
difference between a bug report and an
unsubstantiated rant. I did read your entire post
"A Sad Day" as the latter. Whose mistake that was,
I cannot tell now. Neutral, objective bug reports
would read different, I suppose.</span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It was neither a bug report nor an unsubstantiated
rant. It was a criticism of the complexity of all
current Smalltalks. The few examples of unexpected
complexity in Squeak that Trygve chose to mention are
not the actual issue. No need to feel personally
attacked.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Having worked with a beautifully tiny system like
Smalltalk-78, or even early versions of Squeak, the
complexity in modern Squeak is staggering. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Smalltalk used to be a system that can be fully
understood by a single person - truly a personal
computing system. That is no longer the case.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>All the functionality we added over the years comes
at the price of complexity (not to mention speed). It
makes the system hard to understand. It makes it hard to
see the design principles. We have not found a way to
eliminate, or at least hide, any of the complexity we
introduced.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I don't think there is a "solution" for this within
the current system. We have accepted the complexity, and
now we have to live with it. And we have to accept that
that alienates people who are looking for simplicity and
elegance.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I am sad to see Trygve leave, but I do understand. He
didn't even owe us an explanation. Thank you, Trygve!</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>All the best,</div>
<div>Vanessa</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset></fieldset>
<pre></pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<div>-- <br>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i><span lang="EN-US">The essence of object orientation is
that objects <span>collaborate<span> </span>to</span> achieve a
goal. </span></i><span lang="EN-US"><br>
<span>Trygve</span> <span>Reenskaug</span> </span><span><a href="mailto:%20trygver@ifi.uio.no" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">mailto: trygver@ifi.uio.no</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"><br>
<span>Morgedalsvn</span>.
5A </span><span style="font-size:10pt"><a href="http://folk.uio.no/trygver/" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">http://folk.uio.no/trygver/</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"><br>
N-0378
Oslo </span><span><a href="http://fullOO.info" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">http://fullOO.info</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US"><br>
Norway Tel:
(+47) 468 58 625 </span><span style="font-size:10pt" lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</blockquote></div>