[SqueakDBX] Problems

[Mariano Martinez Peck]

On Sun, Mar 20, 2011 at 8:09 AM, Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito at gmail.com
> wrote:

>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Benoit St-Jean <bstjean at yahoo.com>
> Date: Sat, Mar 19, 2011 at 2:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [SqueakDBX] Problems
> To: Guillermo Polito <guillermopolito at gmail.com>
>
>
> Hi Guillermo,
>
> Since I'm doing lots of stuff using Smalltalk and a plethora of databases,
> I'd be willing to help you guys with SqueakDBX & Glorp.
>

Greate. Just using it and reporting problems is good. For example, non of us
uses Squeak, so if you do, then we have someone testing there.


>
> I'm mostly working on Windows now (WinXP) but I have SQL Server, MS-Access,
> SQLite, Firebird, MySQL, InterBase & PostgreSQL database servers currently
> installed and running.  I can also test Oracle & DB/2 if needed, all this on
> Windows of course.
>

WOW :)   I used to have more or les the same when developing SqueakDBX at
the beginning. THen my machine crashed and now I have all that in a
VirtualBox image :)


>
> If you need to test ports of SqueakDBX, I have many versions of Squeak,
> Pharo and VisualWorks installed as well as Dolphin, ObjectStudio &
> VisualAge.  Even an old VSE environment that I sometimes fire up to soothe
> my nostalgic side!  :)
>


Excellent. Right now, WE want/need to support Pharo and Squeak. The rest, is
up to the users. Of course we would be glad to help if someone does a port.
Indeed, someone did it to Dolphin (I don't know where it is the code).


>
> Anyhow, I've been working exclusively with Smalltalk for the last 20 years
> and used to be working with Glorp's parent, TOPLink.  As a matter of fact,
> my current employer is still using TOPLink with VisualAge & VisualWorks.
>
>
hehehehe


> If I can be of any help, let me know.
>
> P.S.  I have been thinking, for a long time, about creating a *real-world*
> database model to seriously test database-related Smalltalk
> projects/packages/apps. I've always had the impression that testing against
> a 1000 records table ain't telling you much about how the
> app/package/project will behave in reality.  I could create a real
> "benchmark" that could be used across multiple databases in not much time if
> needed.
>

Yes, this is interesting. We have 3 benchmarks: DBXTinyBenchmarks,
DBXBigBenchmarks and DBXMultipleForksBenchmarks.

DBXTinyBenchmarks  does selects up to 10.000 records and using the same
connection.
DBXBigBenchmarks does queries up to 100000
DBXMultipleForksBenchmarks test concurrency, so we do also 100000  but from
different processes using #fork

The biggest problem in Squeak/Pharo about managing millions of records, is
not the framework itself, but the VM and FFI. FFI LOCKS completly the VM
while executing a function: no other smalltalk process can run until such
function is returned. We achieve this problem while using asynchronous
queries in OpenDBX and do active queries to OpenDBX to see whether a querie
was finished or not.... Now, Cog releases a multi-threaded VM which supports
FFI that does not lock the VM. This will be a lot of progress for
Squeak/Pharo.


>
> In fact, most of the stuff I do (I'm working on my own OO-RDBMS mapping
> framework) is tested against millions of records because I've decided,
> upfront, that I would not put performance aside at the start.  My framework
> ain't as "intelligent" and transparent as Glorp but it's fast, simple and
> lightweight.  And I know how it will behave when faced with millions of
> records, with queries using 5-6 LEFT JOINs, subqueries, etc.
>

We are interested in this. We want to build more or less the same. We want
an EASY persistent framework on top of SqueakDBX, that let you creat CRUDs
and prototype apps very easy. Something like ActiveRecord, SandstonDB,
SqueakSave...etc. We are thinking different options and for the moment we
thought to use Magritte. Most Smalltalk web applications uses Magritte. So
the idea is to use Magritte to ALSO describe the mappings. And then using
the description we can get the queries. Keith Hodges did something like
Magritte-RDB  so we are going to investiage that too.

BTW, which is the license of that framework you are doing ?

>
> I think SqueakDBX & Glorp would benefit being "debugged" against some "real
> world" data & volume if we ever consider using those tools in a work
> environment and get passed the "hobby" project.
>
> What do you think?
>

I would love that. We should join forces.


>
> See my favorite headache these days...  :)
>
> http://myfavoriteheadache.wordpress.com/
>
>
Thanks...reading...


>
> -----------------
> Benoit St-Jean
> Yahoo! Messenger: bstjean
> A standpoint is an intellectual horizon of radius zero.
> (Albert Einstein)
>
>
>
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