From pfraser at spatialmedia.com Sun Apr 4 17:22:27 2010
From: pfraser at spatialmedia.com (Peter Fraser)
Date: Sun Apr 4 17:22:54 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Problems logging in to "My Squeakland" from Etoys
Message-ID: <4BB90313.1020103@spatialmedia.com>
Hello (I'm Peter).
If this is the wrong forum, apologies -please send me elsewhere.
I can't log in to "My Squeakland" from EToys. I get a dialog telling me
a 500 error occurred on the server.
Also, when this happens, Etoys appears to get itself into a loop where
it pops up an error dialog, I hit OK -it retries, displays the error
dialog, I hit OK -and on it goes until I close Etoys
Note: This is only a small wrinkle in my otherwise delightful experience
of Etoys since I downloaded it, a couple of weeks ago :-)
Details
1. I can log into my account OK using the web interface (eg
http://squeakland.org/showcase/account/). I had some problems creating
the account (I was getting 500 errors that talked about "out of memory
exceptions" or thereabouts) but it came right the next day.
2. It has worked from Etoys (in the last few days, since I created my
account), and I have managed to upload and download projects.
3. I have tried various machines on various networks, with the same
result. Occasionally I will be able to log in (apparently), but I won't
see any projects.
4.. I can't see a PeteF account in the list displayed in Etoys (but
presumably this is because I haven't published to the showcase).
5. I have tried both "Etoys to go" and (windows) installs. At one point,
the installed version would work -but not the Etoys to go version.
6. [I have never worked with DAV so following is probably spurious] I'm
surprised by the double forward slash in the MKCOL path (in the trace
below). I'm also surprised the conversation starts with MKCOL
7. I have tried (the obligatory windows) reinstall, as well as removing
the Etoys data in "my documents"
8. Sometimes it feels like a client problem (otherwise everyone would be
having problems -right?) -but as per the trace below it is definitely
resulting in a server error -so basically I'm confused.
Happy to sniff around further, if someone wants to point me at a good
place to sniff. I'm not a Smalltalker, but I could pretend...
Pete F
MKCOL /showcase/everyone/accounts//PeteF HTTP/1.1
Host: content.squeakland.org
Authorization: Basic [deleted by pete]
Content-Length: 0
HTTP/1.1 500 Internal Server Error
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2010 00:16:15 GMT
Server: Apache/2.0.52 (Red Hat) DAV/2 PHP/5.1.4 Resin/3.0.8
Content-Length: 197
Set-Cookie: JSESSIONID=aGnaN_CxuHh7; path=/
Connection: close
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
500 Internal Server Error
500 Internal Server Error
Resin-3.0.8 (built Tue, 08 Jun 2004 02:25:40 PDT)
From sthomas1 at gosargon.com Mon Apr 5 12:16:56 2010
From: sthomas1 at gosargon.com (Steve Thomas)
Date: Mon Apr 5 12:16:58 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: squeakland Digest, Vol 84, Issue 1
In-Reply-To: <4bba0908.11ed8c0a.5847.ffffb601SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com>
References: <4bba0908.11ed8c0a.5847.ffffb601SMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com>
Message-ID:
Peter,
Apologies for the problems, I experienced the same issue, I believe someone
may be working on resolving server issues.
You can hit on Mac or on Windows, then a User
Interrupt window will appear. When it does click on (Abandon), then click
Cancel in the Username/Password prompt.
Stephen
On Mon, Apr 5, 2010 at 12:00 PM, wrote:
> Send squeakland mailing list submissions to
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Problems logging in to "My Squeakland" from Etoys (Peter Fraser)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Peter Fraser
> To: squeakland@squeakland.org
> Date: Mon, 05 Apr 2010 09:22:27 +1200
> Subject: [squeakland] Problems logging in to "My Squeakland" from Etoys
> Hello (I'm Peter).
>
>
> If this is the wrong forum, apologies -please send me elsewhere.
>
> I can't log in to "My Squeakland" from EToys. I get a dialog telling me a
> 500 error occurred on the server.
>
> Also, when this happens, Etoys appears to get itself into a loop where it
> pops up an error dialog, I hit OK -it retries, displays the error dialog, I
> hit OK -and on it goes until I close Etoys
>
>
> Note: This is only a small wrinkle in my otherwise delightful experience of
> Etoys since I downloaded it, a couple of weeks ago :-)
>
> Details
>
> 1. I can log into my account OK using the web interface (eg
> http://squeakland.org/showcase/account/). I had some problems creating the
> account (I was getting 500 errors that talked about "out of memory
> exceptions" or thereabouts) but it came right the next day.
>
> 2. It has worked from Etoys (in the last few days, since I created my
> account), and I have managed to upload and download projects.
>
> 3. I have tried various machines on various networks, with the same result.
> Occasionally I will be able to log in (apparently), but I won't see any
> projects.
>
> 4.. I can't see a PeteF account in the list displayed in Etoys (but
> presumably this is because I haven't published to the showcase).
>
> 5. I have tried both "Etoys to go" and (windows) installs. At one point,
> the installed version would work -but not the Etoys to go version.
>
> 6. [I have never worked with DAV so following is probably spurious] I'm
> surprised by the double forward slash in the MKCOL path (in the trace
> below). I'm also surprised the conversation starts with MKCOL
>
> 7. I have tried (the obligatory windows) reinstall, as well as removing the
> Etoys data in "my documents"
>
> 8. Sometimes it feels like a client problem (otherwise everyone would be
> having problems -right?) -but as per the trace below it is definitely
> resulting in a server error -so basically I'm confused.
>
>
> Happy to sniff around further, if someone wants to point me at a good place
> to sniff. I'm not a Smalltalker, but I could pretend...
>
>
>
> Pete F
>
>
>
> MKCOL /showcase/everyone/accounts//PeteF HTTP/1.1
>
> Host: content.squeakland.org
>
> Authorization: Basic [deleted by pete]
>
> Content-Length: 0
>
>
>
> HTTP/1.1 500 Internal Server Error
>
> Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2010 00:16:15 GMT
>
> Server: Apache/2.0.52 (Red Hat) DAV/2 PHP/5.1.4 Resin/3.0.8
>
> Content-Length: 197
>
> Set-Cookie: JSESSIONID=aGnaN_CxuHh7; path=/
>
> Connection: close
>
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>
>
>
> 500 Internal Server Error
>
> 500 Internal Server Error
>
>
> Resin-3.0.8 (built Tue, 08 Jun 2004 02:25:40 PDT)
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> squeakland mailing list
> squeakland@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland
>
>
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From rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de Mon Apr 5 17:18:26 2010
From: rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de (Rita Freudenberg)
Date: Mon Apr 5 17:18:46 2010
Subject: [squeakland] software meeting April 5 - meeting notes
Message-ID: <7D4FE22D-B9D6-40E0-8E76-4F94D7D0B85C@isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de>
Here are the meeting notes from the software meeting today, April 5.
You can also find them on the wiki:
http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/2010/04/05/software+meeting+April%2C+5
Greetings,
Rita
-------------------------------------------------
[21:15] ritaf:so let's start the meeting
[21:16] ritaf:who is here?
[21:16]randy2: Randy is here
[21:16]richo2:Richo
[21:16]MrSteve:Stephen
[21:16]bertf:me
[21:16]ritaf:rita
[21:16]jecel:Present
[21:16]scottwal:scott
[21:17]ritaf:welcome everyone
[21:17] ritaf:and welcome richo!
[21:17]richo2:thanks for inviting me here
[21:18]ritaf:I don't know if you all know that Richo is working on the
GSoC-Squeakland education project
[21:19]randy2:Richo is doing an amazing job
[21:19]ritaf:and as far as I know, he is doing great and looking for
more work
[21:19] ritaf:so I thought it would be a good idea to get some
suggestions from our developers
[21:20]randy2:should I put up our proposal so far?
[21:20]bertf:sure
[21:21]randy2:1. Etoys paint tool The painting tool is one of the most
used features of Etoys. The current implementation would be improved
in order to support features like zoom, multiple undo, and a select
tool, among others. 2. Graphing of Data Tiles for creating vertical
and horizontal grid lines, major and minor tick marks, labels for
axes, and a label for the graph would be created to allow students to
graph data they acquire in science and mathematics project
[21:22]bertf:sounds like nice-to-have features indeed
[21:23]randy2:Richo has already done most of item 2!
[21:24]ritaf:that's great!
[21:24]jecel:Since Dr. Geo is going to be integrated into the next
version of Etoys, I wonder if it includes any of these features?
[21:24]DanGJavaGeek:has anyone @ MIT done user testing with the target
audience on the paint tool for scratch? I would think there would be
similar or related feedback given the target...
[21:25]ritaf:this is a good question, I will find out!
[21:25]jecel:The paint tool isn't as critical for Scratch since they
love to use clip art
[21:25]bertf:jecel: i don't thibk dr geo icludes any of this
[21:26]jecel:bertf: thanks! I only saw a movie or two and don't
remember much about it
[21:26]MrSteve:On item 2, it would be nice to have tools that
facilitate kids learning about data collection, analysis and reporting
[21:27]randy2:Stephen - could you givbe an example of such a tool?
[21:27]MrSteve:The graphing helps with the analysis and reporting, one
thing that would be nice is to have ...
[21:27] MrSteve:Methods to allow kids to create, publish to and
analyze data from their own databases, public, class or project DBs.
[21:28]randy2:That goes along with item 3 also
[21:29]MrSteve:Sorry, what's item 3?
[21:29]randy2:Or do you want a database tool in etoys
[21:29] randy2:1. Etoys paint tool The painting tool is one of the
most used features of Etoys. The current implementation would be
improved in order to support features like zoom, multiple undo, and a
select tool, among others. 2. Graphing of Data Tiles for creating
vertical and horizontal grid lines, major and minor tick marks, labels
for axes, and a label for the graph would be created to allow students
to graph data they acquire in science and mathematics project
[21:29] randy2:Sorry - I tried to copy just item 3 and failed
[21:31]bertf:we do't see a 3rd item
[21:32]MrSteve:Richo, as you will soon find out I have a lot of ideas
and opinions (not all good so before I do a brain dump, what interests
you and what would you like to do?
[21:32]richo2:well, databases aren't my favorites
[21:32]randy2:3. Input/Output of Data From/To Files Tiles would be
created to allow data from the Etoys environment to be output to a
file and for information from an external file to be imported into the
Etoys environment.
[21:33]jecel:There is a third item at http://gsoc2010.esug.org/projects/squeakland-education
[21:33]richo2:the proposal at gsoc2010.esug.org is not up to date
[21:33]MrSteve:"If I knew where I was going to die, I would never go
there"
[21:33]randy2:I haven't updated the project at ESUG yet so it doesn't
agree with what I just posted
[21:33]jecel:Yeah, it doesn't mention the paint app
[21:34]MrSteve:Richo, very wise, knowing what you don't like is
important
[21:34]randy2:I want to update the project after our meeting and I get
more feedback from Richo
[21:35]DanGJavaGeek:are there particular use cases for #3 data import/
export?
[21:35]richo2:steve: you just proposed one of the few things I dislike
the most
[21:35]randy2:to keep a record of student results
[21:36] randy2:to import data to analyze
[21:37]ritaf:I would like to know if anyone has thought about adding
these things to Etoys before?
[21:37]randy2:To answer Dan in more detail: This would allow learners
to import data for visualization in the Etoys environment. Etoys is
richer than most learning environments used in education and very
creative things could be done in Etoys to visualize and use external
data from a file. Learners and Teachers would also benefit from
getting formative feedback on how the learner is progressing. Etoys is
a rich environment of objects and data regarding the learners m
[21:37] ohshima hat den Chatroom betreten.
[21:38]ritaf:hi yoshiki
[21:39]ohshima:Just trying an IRC client on my phone. pls send me the
log afterwards.
[21:39]jecel:Etoys is a bit weak in dealing with table-style data
[21:40]DanGJavaGeek:thanks, I was wondering if there were examples
people wanted to try like data in CSV, graphs, charts, the squeakers
movie example with dropping objects, I guess one could import data
there rather than record individual distances per video frame
[21:40]bertf:ritaf: an improved painting tool sounds obviously useful.
graphing is possible already - but could be made easier of course, if
it fits with the resto of Etoys. Dealing with files is unprecedented.
[21:42]randy2:Scott wrote code for me awhile back to write to and get
from text files. Thanks Scott.
[21:43] randy2:I though it could be made into tiles.
[21:43]bertf:the way Scratch handles files is - it doesn't really. it
has a "list type" which is interactive first and foremost. but it can
export to a text file, and import one - each line becomes a list item
[21:44] bertf:randy2: does it need to be a tile? or is impoting a text
into a holder sufficient? Line by line like Scratch?
[21:44]DanGJavaGeek:right - no requirement that one become the other
but I was trying to put into context where students using the
environment would want and use file I/O, I think randy had reasonable
examples
[21:45]jecel:About tables, has anybody used the Skeleton spreadsheet?
How well does it work and how well does it integrated with the rest of
Etoys?
[21:45]bertf:jecel: no idea, but I was wondering too
[21:45]randy2:Bert - any way that a novice can use without having to
write Smalltalk code.
[21:45]richo2:I played with Skeleton and it's great
[21:45]bertf:randy2: sure. it could be a halo-menu item
[21:46]richo2:but I used the old smallland version of Etoys
[21:46]bertf:richo2: is it scriptable from Etoys?
[21:47]jecel:richo2: that is nice to know. I am just trying to figure
out what will be done with the data once it is imported
[21:47]richo2:you can either write functions as smalltalk code or
connect etoys tiles with cells
[21:47] richo2:so if the value of the cell changes the value of the
etoy tile changes as well
[21:48] richo2:it's very simple
[21:48] ohshima hat den Chatroom verlassen. (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
[21:49]bertf:well, might be worth investigating. Randy - if that
allowed exportign and importing data such a spreadsheat might be
ideal, no?
[21:49]randy2:Bert - yes
[21:50]jecel:The other alternative I see is Kedama - your CSV (comma
separated values) data becomes the patches in a world
[21:53]bertf:yes, but that's rather hard to understand I'd think
[21:54]richo2:I was thinking of something like an Etoys Stream object
[21:54]bertf:richo2: pelase explain
[21:54] bertf:please
[21:54]jecel:Yes, you are limited to SIMD (single instruction multiple
data) which is far less flexible than a spreadsheet
[21:54]richo2:so you would have a slot with the current word
[21:55] richo2:and commands to read the next one or write to a file
[21:55]DanGJavaGeek:that's interesting, so it's not necessarily
limited to file I/O, but could be a stream of items... temperatures,
stock prices, etc., maybe from some network service or a file
[21:55]bertf:richo2: that sounds a lot like programming. very
abstract. the power of etoys is to be concrete.
[21:55]richo2:bertf: yes
[21:56]jecel:Streams are great and I know you are interested in robots
[21:56]richo2:I did something like that a lot of time ago to access
the serial port from etoys
[21:56]DanGJavaGeek:agreed, "power of etoys is to be concrete" and
trying to explain network i/o to k-12 students isn't a fun time
[21:57]richo2:but it was, as bert said, very programming oriented
[21:57]bertf:maybe something like a sensor ... instead of physical
data it would read data from a file
[21:57]DanGJavaGeek:without something concrete and fun to play with,
that is
[21:57]jecel:The reason I was talking about tables instead was that
analysing data for inclusion in reports was mentioned
[21:58]randy2:Bert - you had suggested fixing up etoys code and Richo
sounded interested if it were a well-defined portion. Do you have a
small chunk to suggest for him to work on? Richo are you still
interested or do you have enough already?
[21:59]richo2:I'm very interested in getting etoys working on top of
trunk
[21:59]DanGJavaGeek:on the sensor end, things like http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Sensor_Boards
and Lego WeDo i/o has been interesting for various classrooms that
can afford either, but requiring hardware above and beyond an XO or a
computer lab is limiting
[21:59]bertf:richo2: do you have experience with Monticello?
[22:00]richo2:I know only the basic stuff
[22:00] richo2:I only use it to get the code out of the image
[22:00] richo2:in a way that I can upload to squeaksource
[22:01]bertf:for bringing Etoys closer to the Squeak Trunk, we need to
reorganize the Etoys image. karl started with this
[22:01] bertf:it's a big project
[22:01]richo2:yes, I know... that's why I asked for a well defined task
[22:01] MrSteve hat den Chatroom verlassen. (Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping
timeout))
[22:01]richo2:I don't feel capable of doing it by myself
[22:01]bertf:it's not well-bounded
[22:02] bertf:another pressing need is better translation support.
that is better defined
[22:03] bertf:we need to split up the one big Etoys.po into smaller
parts
[22:03] bertf:e.g., put all tile-translations into one file
[22:03]randy2:What about just fixing some of the languages that don't
work - like Hatian Creole?
[22:04]bertf:randy2: creole is trivial
[22:04] bertf:i sent Tim a fix before he went to haiti
[22:05]randy2:okay
[22:05]bertf:it just was not listed as a Latin1 language
[22:05]richo2:yes, that is better defined. And I think I can do that,
but I would need to investigate a little. I don't know how translation
works
[22:05]bertf:richo2: we should ask korakurider
[22:06] bertf:he did most of the translation framework
[22:06] bertf:and I'm sure he has ideas for how to split it up
[22:06] bertf:we also need wider font support
[22:06] bertf:there is a changeset in the tracker that is untested
[22:07]richo2:what about Juan Vuletich's font stuff?
[22:07]bertf:richo2: that's latin only
[22:07] bertf:we can't effort bitmap fonts for all foreign scripts
[22:07]richo2:oh, I didn't know
[22:07]bertf:Cuis does not even have i18n support IIRC
[22:08] bertf:or m17n rather
[22:08] bertf:anyway, we cant't load all fonts into the image, it just
gets too big
[22:08] bertf:so andreas made a changeset that loads truetype fonts on
demand
[22:08] bertf:it's on mantis somewhere
[22:09] bertf:that would be good to have.
[22:09]richo2:if there is code waiting to be tested I feel much more
comfortable than writing it from scratch
[22:10]bertf:on the XO under Linux we use Pango for non-latin
languages. but it is still really immature. lots of layout problems
[22:10] bertf:OTOH Pango can even render Arabic and Devanagari etc.,
really complicated scripts
[22:11] bertf:tracker is down again
[22:12] bertf:richo2: yes there is code already. we would need to
decide which fonts to include (we do not want to use the host's fonts)
[22:13]richo2:why?
[22:13]bertf:because projects need to look identical across platforms
[22:14] bertf:that's the promise of etoys, bit-identical everywhere
[22:14]richo2:ok
[22:14] MrSteve hat den Chatroom betreten.
[22:15]bertf:I can't use a Mac font in a project that needs to work on
Linux as well
[22:15]richo2:that's the reason Etoys has all those weird fonts?
[22:15]bertf:yep
[22:16] bertf:we need to ship the fonts to use
[22:16] bertf:if we put them on file instead of the image we can
potentially include more/nicer ones
[22:17] bertf:provided we can find some license-compatible ones
[22:17]jecel:If you use Self on a Sun machine, then save the image and
restart it on a Mac it will be very obvious what a stupid idea it is
to use platform fonts
[22:19]richo2:ok, so we need to test andreas code and choose a good
set of fonts to include
[22:20]bertf:right. I;d start with one font that has good glyph
coverage. DejavuLGC for example
[22:20]richo2:I'm sure andreas code will work fine, he doesn't seem to
make a lot of mistakes
[22:20]bertf:oh he does, he is just quick at fixing the bugs too
[22:21] bertf:and since this code is largely untested we don't know
the bugs yet
[22:21]richo2:ok, I can do that... do you know where can I find his
code?
[22:22] richo2:I'm looking in mantis but it is kinda messy
[22:22]bertf:http://tracker.squeakland.org/
[22:22]richo2:oh
[22:22]bertf:if its up look for "fonts"
[22:22]richo2:yep, it's down
[22:22]bertf:has been unreliable for a while
[22:22]richo2:yes, that's a pity
[22:23] MrSteve hat den Chatroom verlassen. (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
[22:23] MrSteve2 hat den Chatroom betreten.
[22:23]richo2:we should update the project proposal with this new
ideas I think
[22:23]ritaf:we can talk about the tracker on the next meeting ...
[22:23]richo2:also, randy didn't finish to show what we already have
[22:24]ritaf:I will send the log files, so you can use it to update
the proposal
[22:24]richo2:ok
[22:24]randy2:Richo - I would like you to update the proposal and add
and delete what you want.
[22:24]richo2:oh, I have a question
[22:24]randy2:Richo - did you get my invitation to join the project?
[22:25]richo2:randy2: yes, I have to write the proposal
[22:25] richo2:that's easy because I have a template
[22:25] richo2:what I don't know is what should I write to apply to
google
[22:25] richo2:also I don't know how the voting works
[22:26] richo2:maybe this is not the best place to ask
[22:26]randy2:Richo - just answer the questions Google asks on the FAC
and include the updated proposal.
[22:27]ritaf:as far as I know, the mentors will vote. But I also
remember something about asking the community before.
[22:28]randy2:Richo - the voting will be done the week after April 9
and I need to promote your project. I believe ESUG mentors vote at
Google for ESUG projects.
[22:28]richo2:ok, that seems reasonable
[22:29]randy2:I have registered and Google as a mentor. The process
seems very complex as new info comes out each day.
[22:30]richo2:yes, it's a mess
[22:30]randy2:ESUG is doing a great job.
[22:30]richo2:their website is a lot more informative than googles
[22:31]randy2:Rita - do the log files come by email?
[22:32]ritaf:I was planning to post it on squeakland, and to put it on
the wiki.
[22:32]randy2:And do you send us the link?
[22:33] randy2:Or do we just go to the wiki?
[22:34]ritaf:I will send the link
[22:35]randy2:Rita - do you have a few minutes to Skype after the
meeting is over?
[22:35]ritaf:yes, I do.
[22:35] ritaf:so I think we can finish the meeting for today?
[22:36]randy2:Richo - do you have any more questions?
[22:36]richo2:no, I'm fine
[22:36] richo2:I'll try to add these new items to the project proposal
[22:37] richo2:and I'll send it back to you
[22:37]randy2:I'm good. Should we quit? Do we just leave the chat?
[22:37]ritaf:thank you all for the meeting!
[22:37] ritaf:randy2: yes, you can just leave
[22:37]bertf:thanks all. randy2: yes, jsut close the browser window
[22:37]randy2:Thank you
[22:38] randy2 hat den Chatroom verlassen. (Quit: CGI:IRC)
[22:38]richo2:bye!
[22:38]ritaf:bye
[22:39] richo2 hat den Chatroom verlassen. (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
Rita Freudenberg
rita@isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de
From teefal at squeakland.org Mon Apr 12 14:38:49 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Mon Apr 12 14:38:58 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Back from Haiti
Message-ID: <43AA3752-C7DD-4F93-9EF6-EC16218C5A12@squeakland.org>
Hello everyone,
I'm back from Haiti, both literally and figuratively. Since the earthquake, nearly all of my time has been spent on the seven Etoys pilots that have started or will soon start in four different regions of Haiti. To follow our progress, read the Waveplace blog and see the two videos at http://waveplace.org/news/. We'll be adding a great many photos in the next few days. Connectivity was very bad, so we are only uploading photos now.
While it may appear that Haiti has benefitted at the expense of Squeakland so far this year, I think quite the opposite is true. The earthquake crisis has drawn Etoys into the center of a conversation that is now happening between many interested groups. I've basically spent the last three months talking, talking, talking. Throughout, I have positioned Squeakland as a source of educational materials. I've depicted Etoys as a learning platform that is very appropriate for a country that has no money for school buildings or materials. In short, I have been laying the groundwork for our fundraising efforts to finish the Squeakland courseware and to improve Etoys itself and its translations.
Along the way, we have also created and tested a brand new set of Basic Etoys lessons, which can be found here:
http://waveplace.com/resources/tutorials/
We have lesson plans, handouts, and sample projects for each of these lessons, both in English and Haitian Creole. Randy Caton has created a mathematics unit that we will use this month in Haiti. We are also creating a Storytelling unit. We will soon have a complete set of the Basic Etoys screencasts in Haitian Creole as well.
Please take the 90 minutes needed to watch these videos and let me know what you think. We will soon begin creating Spanish (and probably Portuguese) versions, so any feedback will have an immediate impact. The Squeakland education team is currently deciding whether to include these lessons in the official Squeakland courseware, so positive comments will also help. Send your comments to squeakland-at-squeakland.org.
As for the business team, software team, and board, we will start regular meetings again starting today:
* software team: Mondays at 3pm ET (19:00 GMT) on #etoys on the freenode.net network (or chat.squeakland.org)
* business team: Wednesdays at 3pm ET (19:00 GMT) by Skype ... send me a private email if you wish to join the team
* board meeting: as soon as we can schedule it
As always, the minutes or transcripts from all of these meetings will be available on our wiki or chat logs.
If you'd like to volunteer to help any of the teams, please let us know, either by responding here, or clicking "contact" on squeakland.org.
Thanks everyone. My humblest apologies for being unavailable over the last three months, but now that I am on the other side of the mountain, I can say with certainty that Squeakland will benefit from this unexpected detour.
Take care,
Tim
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From yoshiki at vpri.org Tue Apr 13 17:30:58 2010
From: yoshiki at vpri.org (Yoshiki Ohshima)
Date: Tue Apr 13 17:31:01 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Back from Haiti
In-Reply-To: <43AA3752-C7DD-4F93-9EF6-EC16218C5A12@squeakland.org>
References: <43AA3752-C7DD-4F93-9EF6-EC16218C5A12@squeakland.org>
Message-ID:
At Mon, 12 Apr 2010 14:38:49 -0400,
Timothy Falconer wrote:
>
> As always, the minutes or transcripts from all of these meetings will be available on our wiki or chat logs.
Past software meeting logs were not available but now they are at:
http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/Developers+meeting+logs
Can anybody tell me where the minutes from the business meetings
are?
-- Yoshiki
From sthomas1 at gosargon.com Wed Apr 14 01:34:44 2010
From: sthomas1 at gosargon.com (Steve Thomas)
Date: Wed Apr 14 01:34:58 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Etoys Class Reflections
Message-ID:
Taught a class today, 4 kids (8, 10, 11, 12, 14) and 2 adults (Mom and Dad
of two of the kids). First class with this group.
Started with "Daemon Castle" and then had them do "Etoys Challenge".
*Observation*:I had one child. Nick, who was laughing hysterically. I went
over and found him playing around making the car go tight circles, bounce
off walls and he eventually figured out how to make it bounce off the walls
until it reached the goal. His father who sitting next to him, got a bit
upset and told him he needed to focus on what he was learning and be more
disciplined.
*Thoughts*:
This reminded me of something another coach told me while coaching Soccer
"Never coach your own kid, (a) they won't listen to you and (b) they will
listen better to another adult". While I don't fully believe (a), I think
they do listen, they just don't want to act like they do, especially in
front of the friends, he made a good point. Also, in my observations parents
are harder on their own kids then they are on others, especially with their
first child.
I love to see kids laugh and having a good time in class, this means they
are having fun and to me fun means MOTIVATION. I firmly believe motivation
trumps most other things, as kids will work hard when motivated. That said
the father had a good point and I needed to find a way to turn that "silly
fun" into what others have termed "hard fun". So I let him finish his
"Etoys Challenge" then when he told me he was done I stepped back and ran
his scripts on each step. I then challenge him to reach the goals using
just one script. I have observed a number of kids who use multiple versions
of the script changing it along the way until they reach the goal. Again I
let them do this and congratulate them on a creative way of solving the
problem and pointing out there are many ways to solve the problem, but can
they find a simpler more elegant way using only one script which doesn't
change?
I always try to have one part of the class where I get them AWAY from the
computers and preferably outside. Today I broke them into pairs and have
them "program" each other. One child, the programmer, would give
instructions to another child "the computer". I first had them try and
program each other to "walk a square". At some point one of the kids will
say "turn" and the other knowing he is supposed to walk a square will
dutifully turn 90 degrees. I then jump in and ask the child to program me.
When I am told to turn I will turn some random value (usually either a very
small turn or a 360 degree turn) and they will get the idea and then ask me
to turn 90 degrees. One kid got excited and came up with the idea of I can
go forward 10 steps, turn 90 degrees and repeat forever. After
complimenting him (kids love compliments) I asked him what was like repeat
forever in Etoys? He said a ticking script. At some point I made the
connection, wish I could remember what brought it up, to how the cells in
our bodies are like millions of little ticking scripts doing their own
things responding to stimulus and working together to make us and how it is
amazing that is.
IMPORTANT TEACHING NOTE: I try to never give a child an answer. Instead I
will either ask them a question or give them another problem that will help
them figure out the answer themselves. Basically a hint in problem or
question form.
*What to do with kids who finish early?*
There are always those who finish faster than others I have a couple of
strategies to deal with this:
1. *Have some problems or other Etoys Challenges they can work on
For this lesson I had "Etoys Game Challenge" which the kids like because
they can create their own games, very motivating for kids.*
2. *Teach them to teach
*This means having them help other kids, but the danger here is they will
simply show the other kids the answers they found. I do my best to impress
upon the kids that they should never give them the answer, but instead help
the other child find the answer themselves by asking questions or getting
them to think about how their program works (aka play computer). I try to
model this and point it out explicitly a bunch of times early in the lesson
so the kids understand my preferred style before I ask them to help teach. I
then monitor the kids closely when they first start "teaching" other kids.
3. *Have the child teach an adult in the class*
The kids get a big kick out of teaching adults.When there are adults this
is especially fun, the kids get a big ego boost (and motivation from feeling
they are better that an adult at something) out of teaching an adult, and it
shows them the adults don't know everything (a valuable lesson in life that
kids figure out faster than most adults would like to believe). The adults
are usually good sports, but read your people some peoples ego's are fragile
and you need to be sensitive to that.
4. *Have them improve or extend their current work*
For example their script may not be the simplest or most elegant (ex:
turn 90, turn -45; one kid had turn 45, turn -45) or having a forward 10
tile in the YES and NO of a test
Some kids will instantly see what they can do with Etoys and start
creating games or other fun stuff. If I see this and they have completed the
main task (sometimes even if they haven't) I will encourage them to improve
their games or show them some basic Etoys functionality that they can use to
improve their game or do what they want.
At the end of class I wanted to set them up for their homework (working on
the 40 Mathematical Shapes challenge) and had them try and get their car's
to "Draw a Square"
(Hmmmm, another idea to get them out of the computer and use the knowledge
they already have is to have them "program" their hands to draw a square on
a piece of paper). While doing this one child asked: "What's this symbol
here do?" He was pointing at the "add a variable" icon in the top bar of the
viewer (looks like a arrow head in a pink background pointing down). At the
time we had a script on the screen to draw a circle (forward:5, turn:5) when
I had a brainstorm. Okay we can use variables to change the value for
forward and turn (I am slow I can't believe it has taken me this long and a
14 year old kid to finally figure this out!!!). So I showed him how to add
the two variables and dragged the variables into the scripting tiles to
replace the 5's and then asked him to make a square without changing his
script. When he looked confused (a feeling I recognize because of my vast
experience with this emotion) I pointed out, a couple of times, that the
car would move forward and turn by the variables we had setup. *I did NOT
point this out by saying it explicitly*. Instead I simply pointed to the
variable (i had dragged a detailed watcher onto the screen for each
variable) and then pointed to the forward tile and asked him how far it
would move forward. He eventually got the idea and I went to work with
another child who had been asking questions. Then all of a sudden I heard
and excited voice saying "Hey I made an Octagon!!!" I then made a big deal
out of his great discovery and pointed out how with one script he could make
multiple shapes just by changing the variables. Then i asked him what other
shapes he could make and left him to have fun.
Towards the end of class I sent them outside again to program themselves (as
opposed to others in this case) to follow a road. I drew a sample road and
then gave each of the kids some chalk and observed. Each child drew a
different shape and I asked them what there program was for following the
road. Fortunately one of the dad's who was there said the scripts we wrote
reminded him of a robot they have at work do deliver mail. I told the kids
some folks have been paid a lot of money to write programs just like the
ones they wrote today to follow the road (when my son heard this he asked
for $100K).
The kids got the idea of programming a car that could drive itself, so I
challenged them to program the "Car of the Future" and asked them to think
about what kinds of challenges they would have and how they would handle
them (other cars, pedestrians, traffic lights). One of the parent's
suggested they test their program by having multiple cars drive in Etoys
world at the same time.
Anyway a lot of fun was had by all and I had to kick the kids out as they
wouldn't stop working on Etoys when the class was done. (a good sign and one
I always see when kids are first exposed to Etoys).
Mr. Steve
Note for future reflection: On teaching kids to think about multiple ways to
solve a problem and learning how to compare solutions.
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From teefal at squeakland.org Wed Apr 14 22:48:47 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Wed Apr 14 22:49:44 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Back from Haiti
In-Reply-To:
References: <43AA3752-C7DD-4F93-9EF6-EC16218C5A12@squeakland.org>
Message-ID: <8D2C1A6B-5122-4ADC-A6C8-37BCCFAD4F79@squeakland.org>
The business meetings in 2009 were primarily between me, Rita, and Kim Rose. We did not take minutes.
All future business meetings will have posted minutes in a manner similar to the education minutes on wiki.squeakland.org.
Tim
On Apr 13, 2010, at 5:30 PM, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> At Mon, 12 Apr 2010 14:38:49 -0400,
> Timothy Falconer wrote:
>>
>> As always, the minutes or transcripts from all of these meetings will be available on our wiki or chat logs.
>
> Past software meeting logs were not available but now they are at:
> http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/Developers+meeting+logs
>
> Can anybody tell me where the minutes from the business meetings
> are?
>
> -- Yoshiki
> _______________________________________________
> squeakland mailing list
> squeakland@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
From teefal at squeakland.org Wed Apr 14 22:49:54 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Wed Apr 14 22:49:48 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Back from Haiti
In-Reply-To:
References: <43AA3752-C7DD-4F93-9EF6-EC16218C5A12@squeakland.org>
Message-ID:
The business meetings in 2009 were primarily between me, Rita, and Kim Rose. We did not take minutes.
All future business meetings will have posted minutes in a manner similar to the education minutes on wiki.squeakland.org.
Tim
On Apr 13, 2010, at 5:30 PM, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote:
> At Mon, 12 Apr 2010 14:38:49 -0400,
> Timothy Falconer wrote:
>>
>> As always, the minutes or transcripts from all of these meetings will be available on our wiki or chat logs.
>
> Past software meeting logs were not available but now they are at:
> http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/Developers+meeting+logs
>
> Can anybody tell me where the minutes from the business meetings
> are?
>
> -- Yoshiki
> _______________________________________________
> squeakland mailing list
> squeakland@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
From carnen at mac.com Fri Apr 16 12:10:58 2010
From: carnen at mac.com (Carlos Rabassa)
Date: Fri Apr 16 12:11:19 2010
Subject: [squeakland] New Great Etoys Tutorials ! !
Message-ID: <5044F821-BB36-4FE1-8DB8-C821CBF09E37@mac.com>
I would like to strongly recommend:
http://waveplace.org/resources/tutorials/
This is a completely new set of tutorials by Tim Falconer.
They were completed last month prior to his departure to Haiti where they were field tested in several pilot projects, some still running.
Nenny and I used the original tutorials to take our first steps in Etoys.
Several good friends of ours learned Etoys through the original tutorials which we all recommended to others.
Last year in Porto Alegre we had the opportunity of talking at the same time to both Tim and Lino Bessonart, a volunteer in Uruguay who created spanish tutorials in Uruguay which were very helpful in getting us started.
Lino said he is also like us, a graduate of Tim's tutorials.
Those tutorials were excellent and helped a many of us in far away places.
But these new ones, I can assure you are far better!
I'm anxious to get them translated into Spanish, they will be a great tool since they include material and tips on how to get the most out of them.
We can see them as great tools for learning and for teaching.
Teachers, parents, volunteers and children will take great advantage of these tutorials.
They have been translated to Creole.
I'm ready to start translating to Spanish as soon as I get the authorization.
Carlos Rabassa
Montevideo, Uruguay
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From teefal at squeakland.org Fri Apr 16 12:27:44 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Fri Apr 16 12:27:45 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Waveplace at the epicenter in Haiti
Message-ID: <9C82F5B4-B900-44A4-BBA5-6BB29153EED4@squeakland.org>
(from a recent Waveplace blog post by Beth Santos ... Joseph is one of our Haitian mentors)
Yesterday I sat down with Joseph's brother, Abela, who works with Haiti Partners. We were sitting under his little tin roof lean-to, looking at the remains of his home- a beautiful two-story building that is now a couple of tiles and lots of space. He praised the [Waveplace] program and seemed so pleased that it was going well here in Leogane. I told him that there are a number of people in the USA that believe that laptops are not the answer right now, especially in areas like Leogane that are most affected by the earthquake. He and Joseph looked at me like I was crazy. ?Are you kidding??? he asked. ?Food, water, sure, we need that. But EDUCATION- that's what we really need right now! Without it, how will we be able to build our own?? Joseph added the fact that the kids in Leogane need something to focus on, more than anything. So many children have PTSD and they just need to look forward. They feel helpless and they need to make use of themselves, and take their minds off of what happened to them and their families.
Abela sat for a moment. We told him how grateful we were for his hospitality and he fell silent. When he spoke, he told us about how, after the earthquake, everyone went to stay in camps but he couldn't do it. He would come home everyday, early in the morning, and sit outside his house and just be quiet. He says his post-traumatic stress is terrible.
We think of the children who are still staying in tents, and we think about how our education program is helping their minds to not only escape, but to grow. These children finally feel that they are worth something. And in Leogane, the program is more valuable than anything.
(for more, read here: http://waveplace.org/news/blog ... photos and more video coming soon)
--
Timothy Falconer
Waveplace Foundation
http://waveplace.org
+ 1 610 624 3760
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From rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de Wed Apr 21 08:13:32 2010
From: rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de (Rita Freudenberg)
Date: Wed Apr 21 08:07:21 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Join us for a sprint week before Squeakfest in July!
Message-ID:
Hi all,
we are planning to have a one week sprint right before Squeakfest this year, from July, 17 - July 24. I would like to invite you to participate in this event! We plan to book a vacation home on a beach near Wilmington (NC), so that we can stay together, work, and have fun.
There are no detailed plans yet about what exactly we will work on in this week. We could for example:
- write an Etoys cookbook, a collection of tips & tricks about what you can do within Etoys
- develop active essays within Etoys for certain subjects
- develop introductional material for kids
- have a "code sprint"
- ...
We are open for your ideas! What we will finally work on also depends on the experience of the participants of the sprint.
Please let me know if you are interested in participating, since I have to do the booking soon. We cannot provide any financial support. If you have any ideas on how to get funding for this effort, let me know!
Greetings,
Rita
From teefal at squeakland.org Wed Apr 21 09:35:30 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Wed Apr 21 09:35:31 2010
Subject: [squeakland] business meet today at 3pm ET (19:00 GMT)
Message-ID: <35156305-C6C5-4BDD-A5E2-D02B9C028A0D@squeakland.org>
Hi everyone,
The Squeakland business team will meet today at 3pm ET (19:00 GMT) via Skype.
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?month=4&day=21&year=2010&hour=19&min=0&sec=0&p1=0
Topics will include:
* the Squeakland Courseware proposal and budget
* fundraising opportunities
* revisiting the 2010 budget prepared last fall
* preparing for next week's board meeting on Tuesday at 3pm ET (19:00 GMT)
We will also briefly discuss the Waveplace Haiti proposal, as it pertains to the Squeakland Courseware proposal.
If you are not currently on the business team, but would like to attend, let me know and give me your Skype account name.
Meeting notes will be posted after the meeting.
Take care,
Tim
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From subbukk at gmail.com Wed Apr 21 14:50:51 2010
From: subbukk at gmail.com (K. K. Subramaniam)
Date: Wed Apr 21 14:50:59 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: [etoys-dev] Join us for a sprint week before
Squeakfest in July!
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
On Wednesday 21 April 2010 05:43:32 pm Rita Freudenberg wrote:
> - write an Etoys cookbook, a collection of tips & tricks about what you can
> do within Etoys
My daughter pointed out that driving was more fun when the forward and turn
parameters are keyed to World->sound level and pitch. She got a bunch of kids
to use their voices to drive morphs around. You can imagine the din :-).
Subbu
From sthomas1 at gosargon.com Wed Apr 21 14:58:43 2010
From: sthomas1 at gosargon.com (Steve Thomas)
Date: Wed Apr 21 14:58:47 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: [etoys-dev] Join us for a sprint week before
Squeakfest in July!
In-Reply-To: <201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
References:
<201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
Subbu,
This sounds like fun. I found the World "sound level" and "sound pitch",
what needs to be done so kids can use their voices to change these
parameters?
Stephen
On Wed, Apr 21, 2010 at 2:50 PM, K. K. Subramaniam wrote:
> On Wednesday 21 April 2010 05:43:32 pm Rita Freudenberg wrote:
> > - write an Etoys cookbook, a collection of tips & tricks about what you
> can
> > do within Etoys
> My daughter pointed out that driving was more fun when the forward and turn
> parameters are keyed to World->sound level and pitch. She got a bunch of
> kids
> to use their voices to drive morphs around. You can imagine the din :-).
>
> Subbu
> _______________________________________________
> etoys-dev mailing list
> etoys-dev@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/etoys-dev
>
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From rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de Thu Apr 22 08:15:23 2010
From: rita at isg.cs.uni-magdeburg.de (Rita Freudenberg)
Date: Thu Apr 22 08:09:11 2010
Subject: [squeakland] education meeting agenda for today
Message-ID:
We have on the agenda for the education meeting today, 12:30 EDT.
* GSoC news
* Haiti pilot and lessons
* National Summit on Citizen Diplomacy (mail from Kathleen)
* Waveplace courseware proposal
If you have more topics, please let me know.
Greetings,
Rita
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From teefal at squeakland.org Thu Apr 22 15:21:35 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Thu Apr 22 15:21:34 2010
Subject: [squeakland] stepping down from squeakland
Message-ID:
Hi everyone,
After much soul searching, I've decided to step down as director of Squeakland Foundation.
Since the earthquake in Haiti, my time has largely been spent on our Waveplace education pilots there, which have been very successful and are growing fast. Last night I decided that I need to stay focused on Haiti and our other Waveplace work, that I no longer have time for the additional responsibilities of Squeakland. I leave you in the very capable hands of Rita Freudenberg and whomever the new board decides.
I still love Etoys, and will continue to teach it and promote it, though this will now be through Waveplace, not Squeakland. What has been called the "Squeakland Courseware" will now become the "Waveplace Courseware". Same stuff, different website. I will continue to fundraise for courseware development, this will be through Waveplace now. All materials will remain freely distributable.
Immuexa, my software company, will continue to host and support the Squeakland website and showcase for free. Squeakland will now be our client, as Viewpoints was before.
My very best to the many people I have meet in the last fifteen months. Thank you for your passion, your time, your talent. What a gift to work with such incredible people!
Take care,
Tim
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From carnen at mac.com Thu Apr 22 15:37:36 2010
From: carnen at mac.com (Carlos Rabassa)
Date: Thu Apr 22 15:37:36 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Need help to have project published
Message-ID:
Since last February I have been trying to publish this project:
Aprendo I Learn 006 B (2010-abr-05 20:00 EDT)
por Carlos Rabassa
Animation with Wooden Dummy
Still doesn?t show in the showcase.
Never received any notice about anything wrong with it.
Children are being invited to a contest of animation projects and would like to share this example of animation to encourage them.
Thanks for any help or suggestions.
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From carnen at mac.com Thu Apr 22 18:14:08 2010
From: carnen at mac.com (Carlos Rabassa)
Date: Thu Apr 22 18:14:09 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Etoys and Scratch Contest
Message-ID: <1275FE31-6677-4198-9C5B-7C486ACE8D76@mac.com>
I translate an announcement from:
http://www.ceibal.edu.uy
"DARE" contest
"Efecto Cine" and "Plan Ceibal" are getting together to organize the first national contest of XO animated short movies.
The winning entries will be incorporated to the annual festival organized by "Efecto Cine".
The intention of the contest is to promote the use of the XO computers distributed by "Plan Ceibal", as a tool to develop the creativity and imagination of Uruguay's children. This to be achieved creating animated projects with Etoys and Scratch.
Dare to create!
For bases, guides and inscription form, click on "Read More"
For the competition bases, clic here
?Need help with scratch? clic here
The form to enter your personal information when submitting projects, will be available soon.
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From teefal at squeakland.org Thu Apr 22 20:17:13 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Thu Apr 22 20:17:08 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Need help to have project published
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID: <149736E1-D168-459C-87BD-DB5564B91E80@squeakland.org>
Carlos,
I'm looking into it now.
Tim
On Apr 22, 2010, at 3:37 PM, Carlos Rabassa wrote:
> Since last February I have been trying to publish this project:
>
> Aprendo I Learn 006 B (2010-abr-05 20:00 EDT)
> por Carlos Rabassa
>
> Animation with Wooden Dummy
>
> Still doesn?t show in the showcase.
>
> Never received any notice about anything wrong with it.
>
> Children are being invited to a contest of animation projects and would like to share this example of animation to encourage them.
>
> Thanks for any help or suggestions.
> _______________________________________________
> squeakland mailing list
> squeakland@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From teefal at squeakland.org Thu Apr 22 20:26:21 2010
From: teefal at squeakland.org (Timothy Falconer)
Date: Thu Apr 22 20:26:15 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Need help to have project published
In-Reply-To:
References:
Message-ID:
Try now.
On Apr 22, 2010, at 3:37 PM, Carlos Rabassa wrote:
> Since last February I have been trying to publish this project:
>
> Aprendo I Learn 006 B (2010-abr-05 20:00 EDT)
> por Carlos Rabassa
>
> Animation with Wooden Dummy
>
> Still doesn?t show in the showcase.
>
> Never received any notice about anything wrong with it.
>
> Children are being invited to a contest of animation projects and would like to share this example of animation to encourage them.
>
> Thanks for any help or suggestions.
> _______________________________________________
> squeakland mailing list
> squeakland@squeakland.org
> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From carnen at mac.com Fri Apr 23 14:40:02 2010
From: carnen at mac.com (Carlos Rabassa)
Date: Fri Apr 23 14:40:22 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Concurso Etoys y Scratch
Message-ID: <2CF21A25-A9B1-4200-A460-E5FBBEA0C7F6@mac.com>
Tim,
thank you very much for helping us with the publication of our gym class animation.
We needed it to complete this page
http://docs.google.com/View?id=dg7q79cx_552hcbdwbcp
of the bilingual study guide we started a few months ago.
We wanted to publish it now because we just saw the announcement of a contest of Etoys project in Uruguay.
We thought this page and examples could encourage some children to enter the contest.
In a recent posting we put some information about the context, if I read it correctly entries will be accepted from now up to June 15th.
From subbukk at gmail.com Fri Apr 23 22:06:52 2010
From: subbukk at gmail.com (K. K. Subramaniam)
Date: Fri Apr 23 22:06:58 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: [etoys-dev] Join us for a sprint week before
Squeakfest in July!
In-Reply-To:
References:
<201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201004240736.53283.subbukk@gmail.com>
On Thursday 22 April 2010 12:28:43 am Steve Thomas wrote:
> This sounds like fun. I found the World "sound level" and "sound pitch",
> what needs to be done so kids can use their voices to change these
> parameters?
Sound level is related to volume, so with:
forward: world sound level / 10.
you can make an etoy move faster by shouting louder or stop it with silence.
If you set:
turn by: (World sound pitch - 500) / 100
then you can get it to spin around by screaming or whistling different tunes at
it. Tweak the magic numbers to your taste.
The idea here is to help children discover that sound has numeric properties
too and these properties can influence other properties like color, geometry or
motion.
Once students get the hang of it, you can introduce the concept of
'smoothing'.
value = previous value*t + current value*(1-t).
previous value = value.
where t is fraction in the range 0 .. 1.
Get some ear plugs :-) .. Subbu
From sthomas1 at gosargon.com Sat Apr 24 00:38:32 2010
From: sthomas1 at gosargon.com (Steve Thomas)
Date: Sat Apr 24 00:38:28 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: [etoys-dev] Join us for a sprint week before
Squeakfest in July!
In-Reply-To: <201004240736.53283.subbukk@gmail.com>
References:
<201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
<201004240736.53283.subbukk@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
Subbu,
Thanks, I like the idea of 'smoothing" my main question though is how do I
get "sound level" and "sound pitch" to change values? On my Mac they are
always zero. World Stethoscope seems to work, I'll try that.
Thanks,
Stephen
On Fri, Apr 23, 2010 at 10:06 PM, K. K. Subramaniam wrote:
> On Thursday 22 April 2010 12:28:43 am Steve Thomas wrote:
> > This sounds like fun. I found the World "sound level" and "sound pitch",
> > what needs to be done so kids can use their voices to change these
> > parameters?
> Sound level is related to volume, so with:
> forward: world sound level / 10.
> you can make an etoy move faster by shouting louder or stop it with
> silence.
> If you set:
> turn by: (World sound pitch - 500) / 100
>
> then you can get it to spin around by screaming or whistling different
> tunes at
> it. Tweak the magic numbers to your taste.
>
> The idea here is to help children discover that sound has numeric
> properties
> too and these properties can influence other properties like color,
> geometry or
> motion.
>
> Once students get the hang of it, you can introduce the concept of
> 'smoothing'.
>
> value = previous value*t + current value*(1-t).
> previous value = value.
>
> where t is fraction in the range 0 .. 1.
>
> Get some ear plugs :-) .. Subbu
>
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From subbukk at gmail.com Sat Apr 24 02:38:15 2010
From: subbukk at gmail.com (K. K. Subramaniam)
Date: Sat Apr 24 03:17:50 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Re: [etoys-dev] Join us for a sprint week before
Squeakfest in July!
In-Reply-To:
References:
<201004240736.53283.subbukk@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201004241208.15795.subbukk@gmail.com>
On Saturday 24 April 2010 10:08:32 am Steve Thomas wrote:
> Thanks, I like the idea of 'smoothing" my main question though is how do I
> get "sound level" and "sound pitch" to change values? On my Mac they are
> always zero. World Stethoscope seems to work, I'll try that.
I don't use Mac that much. I used System Preferences -> Sound -> Input to
adjust mic settings to get sound input working in Squeak.
HTH .. Subbu
From bert at freudenbergs.de Sat Apr 24 16:10:53 2010
From: bert at freudenbergs.de (Bert Freudenberg)
Date: Sat Apr 24 16:12:04 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Accessing sound level (was Re: Join us for a sprint
week before Squeakfest in July!)
In-Reply-To:
References:
<201004220020.52375.subbukk@gmail.com>
<201004240736.53283.subbukk@gmail.com>
Message-ID:
(please remember to change the subject line when a discussion thread wanders off the original topic)
On 24.04.2010, at 06:38, Steve Thomas wrote:
> Subbu,
>
> Thanks, I like the idea of 'smoothing" my main question though is how do I get "sound level" and "sound pitch" to change values? On my Mac they are always zero. World Stethoscope seems to work, I'll try that.
>
> Thanks,
> Stephen
I can't get it to work on the Mac here, either. But there is a trick I used before:
Get a SoundRecorder. Click Record, then Stop, to get it going. Whenever you make noise, the yellow bar will extend.
Now here comes the trick: that yellow bar is an object. Make some noise to make it large enough to click, then get its halo (it's called "Morph1"). Now you can just use its width (from "extended geometry") in another script ...
There is a lesson to learn for developers from this: whenever possible, don't just modify draw routines, use actual objects instead. The "normal" way to program this would be to paint the bar onto the screen. But when you do that, it's just pixels, not objects anymore. By making the bar an actual object, its properties, such as width, can be accessed. Objects FTW ;)
- Bert -
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From marta at pensamentodigital.org.br Mon Apr 26 00:23:39 2010
From: marta at pensamentodigital.org.br (Marta Voelcker)
Date: Mon Apr 26 00:23:44 2010
Subject: [squeakland] ENC: stepping down from squeakland
Message-ID: <000001cae4f8$3fb9bd40$bf2d37c0$@org.br>
Hi Tim,
We had great achievements in 2009, I would like to thank you especially for
your efforts on organizing Squeakfest Brasil 2009, for coming to Porto
Alegre to help me make it happen, and even for going to ?Olimpico Soccer
Stadium? to cheer for Gremio Soccer team, in a terrible cold night of
winter !!!! I hope that Waveplace extends its activities to South America
soon, so you come to visit us again!
I am sure we will keep working together and strength partnerships among
organizations. As hardware gets less expensive, sooner or later laptops and
other kinds of technology will arrive in schools all over. The need for
software, knowledge, materials and guidance is growing and getting more
evident, we all have tons of work to help technology improve education and
children?s life,
A good energy for all!
Marta
De: Timothy Falconer [mailto:teefal@squeakland.org]
Enviada em: quinta-feira, 22 de abril de 2010 16:26
Para: squeakland@squeakland.org
Assunto: stepping down from squeakland
Hi everyone,
After much soul searching, I've decided to step down as director of
Squeakland Foundation.
Since the earthquake in Haiti, my time has largely been spent on our
Waveplace education pilots there, which have been very successful and are
growing fast. Last night I decided that I need to stay focused on Haiti and
our other Waveplace work, that I no longer have time for the additional
responsibilities of Squeakland. I leave you in the very capable hands of
Rita Freudenberg and whomever the new board decides.
I still love Etoys, and will continue to teach it and promote it, though
this will now be through Waveplace, not Squeakland. What has been called the
"Squeakland Courseware" will now become the "Waveplace Courseware". Same
stuff, different website. I will continue to fundraise for courseware
development, this will be through Waveplace now. All materials will remain
freely distributable.
Immuexa, my software company, will continue to host and support the
Squeakland website and showcase for free. Squeakland will now be our
client, as Viewpoints was before.
My very best to the many people I have meet in the last fifteen months.
Thank you for your passion, your time, your talent. What a gift to work
with such incredible people!
Take care,
Tim
--
Timothy Falconer
Squeakland Foundation
http://squeakland.org
610-797-3100
--
"Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget
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From bert at freudenbergs.de Mon Apr 26 10:23:57 2010
From: bert at freudenbergs.de (Bert Freudenberg)
Date: Mon Apr 26 10:25:10 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Etoys developer chat today
Message-ID: <725F1086-E5FC-4C64-80E3-7A175A62D9E3@freudenbergs.de>
Please join our weekly Etoys developer chat today. Follow this link to see the time in your local time zone:
http://tinyurl.com/3xfx4es
To participate, enter your name as nickname on
http://chat.squeakland.org/
and press "Login". Then say hi :-)
Alternatively, use an IRC client of your choice to join #etoys on irc.freenode.net
Everyone is welcome!
- Bert -
From bert at freudenbergs.de Mon Apr 26 20:09:45 2010
From: bert at freudenbergs.de (Bert Freudenberg)
Date: Mon Apr 26 20:10:45 2010
Subject: [squeakland] Etoys developer chat log
Message-ID: <8B650E43-C053-4CE8-9C52-6056719D909A@freudenbergs.de>
Hi all,
we had another nice chat today. Topics included
* what does @HELP achieve in the #etoys channel
* how to fix up the ancestry of Monticello packages we create
* and what to do about remaining packaging differences
* how to get more reliable #etoys logs (perhaps same as #squeak?)
* how to call next release? The update stream uses "etoys4.1" for now, the bug tracker "etoys 2010". "Etoys 5" would be an option too. Discussion welcome.
* lack of documentation on extending Etoys, or even of its overall design
* progress on User Manual
* discussing Ricardo's GSoC project (Randy will set up a Google Group)
* Maybe move all Squeakland mailing lists and forums to Google? would get rid of the forum spam issues
Next chat will be next Monday, same time and place. But the channel is open 24/7, you can try to catch us any time (and use @ALL or @HELP to get our attention).
Full log below. Once we have regular logging I won't have to spam the list with this anymore ...
- Bert -
hi all
hi
hi folks
--> hilaire (~hilaire@bon74-1-88-184-136-97.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #etoys
hi
Randy: try a longer nick name, append soem characters
hello
hello
"randy" is probably registered to another person
<-> Guest85605 is now known as randycat
that worked
randycat: nice :)
cool, so let's start
did anyone try the updates?
The official notice of Richo's google award will be any minute - I hope nothing changed
yes, that's awesome. I hear there was quite some discussion at ESUG which projects to support, right?
it was tense
but he's doing great, good choice
bertf: ah, good call
does anyone have anything specific we need to talk about?
--> squeaker761 (~40379e74@skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys
kencausey: you mean the web irc thing or what? "maintain"
yes, the web chat client
<-> squeaker761 is now known as bander
ah, bander, hi
hi
kencausey: well it;s working for now
just listening today :-)
true
bander: good luck with that. ;)
kencausey: also, tim said he will continue to maintain the servers for now
sure
What does the @HELP prefix actually do?
it makes my icon bounce ;)
For example, does the bot suggest alternate help sources? Unfortunately people that use it rarely get answered.
we all entered that as custom-highlight to our clients
nothing to do with the bot
ah, I see, not bot related then
bander: I did have a question for you
I published a recategorization to the update stream
sure
but comparing teh packages now to the trunk ones there are still a lot of differences
like, where did flash go?
No clue. 3.9 road kill?
We should restore it
do you think we should just make our own packages now? without ancestry?
I thought about "adopting" some existing packages
How about adopting an older version?
:)
I thought about doing that with the earlies ones I can find
in the 39a repo
The alternative is to move it into separate packages
flash you mean
Yes
seems like the better plan to me
--> BackOrder (~4ad28298@skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys
I can look at that if it helps
it's time to transition to the core releases plus a basic built from the core with packages added
then etoys can start with the core and go from there
yeah. well. I was so happy to have a reasonably categorized version today at 4 am that I published it
sure
kencausey: yes that is the long-tem plan
bander: that would be excellent
-*- saijanai_ unlurks and starts reading backlog
I'll see if I can find some time this week
at least now we have some good tools to work with
-*- kencausey resists talking about non-etoys issues
good boy ;)
BackOrder: hi - do we know you?
IanT perhaps?
no idea, that nick doesn't ring a bell
in any case I want this to be done asap so we can start integrating the actual patches lingering on the tracker
Actually, I think we should keep the current version of the Flash package in the Etoys repo for the time being
oh definitely
I want all packages to at least have a copy in the etoys repo
Sounds reasonable
so the etoys release will only contain packages from there
which might have a master elsewhere but still
bertf: in Portugal, they are using an old Etoys version, 3.9 but they want move to Etoys 4.0. They say they did some work on the older version and the biggest problem is to do it all again for the new Etoys. What would you recommend for them to so? And especially, is the new update stream helping there?
will any of the changes you are planning effect what Ricardo Moran creates for GSoC?
ritaf: depends on what work they did
bertf: I don't know the details, I will ask.
bertf: maybe I shold just invite Luis for the next meeting
ritaf: the best thing to do would be to get them involved in the dev process
randycat: shouldn't. we're not planning to do any big changes for this summer's release
randycat: what we're talking about is just a different way to organize the code, not actually modifying teh code itself
not in a big way anyhow
sorry folks, gotta run - eliot's dragging me out for lunch
--> karlram (~51aa9a7e@skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys
hello
bander: thanks for stopping by
hi karlram
karlram: hi. awesome :)
hi
you just missed andreas, we were talking about the new packages
ah
kencausey: do you have an idea for better loggin this channel?
Hi guys! Yes, I am Ian Trudel. :)
will there be logs ?
hi
karlram: sure
cool
bertf: well, we might be able to invite clog as long as you want total logging and not something directly controllable.
karlram: I just emailed you the backlog
thanks
that woudl put logs at tunes.org/~nef/logs/
kencausey: that would be awesome. just like for #squeak right?
BackOrder: Hi Ian
bertf: yes, trick is remembering who to contact
I decided to take a peek in this chatroom after Bert's invitation on Squeak-Dev.
Brian Rice might know, shall I look into it?
kencausey: please, yes. thanks
I removed the broken "sm" log link from the topic today
ok, logs, there was somethign else I wanted to ask ...
ah, yes. karlram: I notiuced you added changesets to the tracker but did not mark teh issues "resolved"
are you happy with the way the tracker works now?
or with the way we're using it?
the process is a little unclear
well we're abusing the system
let me dig out the link
i'm not sure what the diffrent thing stand for
http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/Process
well it's unfortunate that they do not mean what they usually mean
ok, i'll read that
<-- BackOrder (~4ad28298@skylab.immuexa.com) has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout))
that's how we tried to operate, though it wasn't working too well I think
but etoys 5 is our next release ?
next target
to me it feels more liek a minor release
--> BackOrder (~ian@130-152.sh.cgocable.ca) has joined #etoys
got to go soon. Copy of my notes re AV on Ubuntu Karmic (will be on swiki alter in the week): http://pastebin.com/J5E1jgK1
matmo: thanks !
it minor in some ways
major if we get it up to squeak 4.1
no chance
:-)
there are way too many issues to make that leap that soon :)
ok
question: is anyone working on how to make it easier to extend etoys? I'm just trying to nibble around the edges and it looks somewhat daunting
so the development version we're working on now I'd like to call 4.1.
And I would say there is work to be done on the Squeak side as well, so it would be better to aim for Squeak 4.2 or something like that
saijanai_: no one really. help welcome :)
well, I'd like to, but I'm slow at digesting, so no promises
name the issues you have with extending ?
sure. but let us know where you feel you're hitting a wall
getting started is the first issue. NOt sure where to start
almost everythignis possible, but seldomly obvious and sometimes not trivial
there should be some example project around....
saijanai_: you wanted to add your own tiles IIRC right?
right. I think you were the one who sent me info on the GSoC project? or was that someone else?
not sure
if youre not the one doing the work ont eh GSoC then it was someone else :-)
the work is dan by Ricardo
s/dan/done/
ah, OK, so Ricardo is the one who sent me the info
Ricardo is posting his progress on SqueakSource
there is a lot of oral history around squeak ...
some things seem to never have been written up
many things
and by the time someone tries, they've changed beyond recognition, or such is my impression
which is both good and bad - good because the system is evolving, bad because it's harder to catch up
how's the etoys book coming along?
the ref manual?
y
ritaf would know
last time I checked it looked pretty good
bertf:true
but it is a user's manual, not a developer's one
we have most of the text done, now one issue is formatting, so that it is better to read and then reviewing.
kencausey: do you know which paper outlined the general principles of Etoys?
like, the fat object model etc
yeah, I've got many plans concerning etoys. The Scratch in Second Life could be extended in many ways (direct manipulation of prims via packet injection instead of LSL scripts, for example)
saijanai_: basically, in etoys you only have a a single kind of object. no classes/inheritance etc.
that object is called "Player"
right. Based off of the Self design, with much kludging to make it work in Squeak
everything you want to be scriptable, you must add to Player
OK, sorta got that from what Ricardo told me
no, Morphic comes from Self, but Etoys is yet another layer
There is an indirection compared to Self - a Player may have several Costumes
ah, OK. my bad
right, what jecel said
so when you make an Etoys script it looks liek you are working with a morph, but in fact you are working with a Player
bertf: I want to start a place where teachers and developers can download and discuss Ricardo's tools. What do you think about Google Groups?
bertf: no, jecel?
-*- kencausey checks new blue book
hmm, too old perhapos
randycat: hmm. good question
I'm willing to participate in such a discussion groiup.
kencausey: I have never read a paper about the Etoys architecture, but did see one about Tweak which has some features in common
I posted a simple changeset that adds camera tracking to Etoys on Etoys-dev
randycat: you think the squeakland list would be inappropriate?
jecel: yeah, I'm not sure what paper bertf is refering too
kencausey: maybe the one in my head ;)
must be some paper from Alan
is the squeakland list still linked to some web forums?
we'd have to ask Scott
he has some stuff on the vpri.org
jecel: yes, though they are just spam repositories
I though Google Groups might be more approachable by teachers and easier to archive.
bertf: I was afraid of that
randycat: then we have a problem with the squeakland list, which is supposed to be approachable by teachers
randycat: I like running our own tools whenever possible, but google groups seems reasonable for this case.
http://www.pcs.cnu.edu/~rcaton/ESUG/ESUG.html is the link Ricardo sent me
saianai> ask question on etoys-dev mail list when you run into issus
issues
that's how I got the link :-)
randycat: how about moving the whole squeakland list to google groups? (just speculating, not actually proposing it yet)
ritaf: any comment? ^^^
saijanai: I set u that link, but it is just a web page
Ricardo?
thanks
saijanai_: Ricardo is doing the work, and Randy is mentoring him
bertf: let me think about that. I don't know yet what that would mean.
ah, OK. Misread who sent what to whom then
thanks anyways :-)
ritaf: well for one it would mean we don't have to maintain the lists on our own
bertf: can the squeakland list do all that Google Groups can in one environment?
also, google is good about filtering spam