[squeakland] [etoys-dev] About Skeleton

Mon Oct 24 10:34:06 EDT 2011

Hi guys, I haven't received any response from Avi Bryant regarding the
license of his csv parser, probably because I might have an old/incorrect
mail. But anyway, it doesn't matter, because it's easy to write one. So I
uploaded a new version of Skeleton with my little csv parser and I moved the
CSV package to treated.

I think this version is good enough to be integrated in Etoys, what do you
think?

Cheers,
Richo

P.S. I attached a simple project in order to help educators test it without
going through Monticello :)

On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 9:21 PM, Ricardo Moran <richi.moran at gmail.com>wrote:

>
>
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 9:38 PM, karl ramberg <karlramberg at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 1:02 AM, Ricardo Moran <richi.moran at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> > I uploaded to the inbox a version of Skeleton with a few changes of mine
>> > that allows you to use a spreadsheet just as you would use mine to
>> > import/export data and iterate over its contents.
>> > I also commited a version of the CSV package, which I use to do the
>> > importing. However, I didn't remember to look at the license of the
>> package
>> > before clicking commit and now that I did, I see it doesn't specify MIT,
>> so
>> > I'll ask the author about it (please forgive me and remove the commit if
>> it
>> > can be a problem).
>> > Anyway, if you can please tell me what you think.
>> > Cheers,
>> > Richo
>>
>> That is CSV Parser from SqueakSource right ?
>> I don't see a licence anywhere ...
>> Can you mail Avi Bryant and ask ?
>>
>
> Yes, I did. I'm waiting for an answer now...
>
> Richo
>
>
>>
>> Karl
>> >
>> > On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 7:28 PM, karl ramberg <karlramberg at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 6:59 PM, Randy Caton <rcaton at cnu.edu> wrote:
>> >> > I like the spreadsheet that Ricardo created because it is simple and
>> >> > basic
>> >> > and allows I/O. It leaves more for learners to create. Couldn't the
>> >> > functions already in etoys be used in the cells? Does Skeleton allow
>> >> > plots?
>> >> > If so, then what about Ricardo's graphs? I'd like to see them in
>> etoys
>> >> > also.
>> >> > Randy
>> >>
>> >> Hi
>> >> I think it is possible to make all these graphs out of skeleton.
>> >> From what I see is Skeleton a extension to the way we script and
>> >> visualize in Etoys,
>> >> It seems to have a thought out model.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Only working with it and managing the code will tell if it something
>> >> we find useful and worth while.
>> >>
>> >> Karl
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > Randall Caton
>> >> > 41596 Bald Eagle Drive
>> >> > Bigfork, MN 56628
>> >> > 218-832-3490
>> >> > http://www.pcs.cnu.edu/~rcaton
>> >> > Sent from my iPhone
>> >> > On Oct 11, 2011, at 11:41 AM, Ricardo Moran <richi.moran at gmail.com>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 11:20 AM, Bert Freudenberg
>> >> > <bert at freudenbergs.de>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On 11.10.2011, at 14:34, Ricardo Moran wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > Hi,
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > The squeak list is currently discussing about a spreadsheet morph,
>> >> >> > and
>> >> >> > that just reminded me about how cool is Skeleton actually. So I'm
>> >> >> > wondering
>> >> >> > why it is not in Etoys? I found an old discussion stating that it
>> >> >> > could be a
>> >> >> > nice extension to Etoys but the biggest issue being the slow
>> loading
>> >> >> > of
>> >> >> > external code. I have to agree with that being a problem but I
>> think
>> >> >> > we
>> >> >> > might reconsider just include it in the image as with Dr Geo.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I know we already have a bloated image full of half finished
>> projects
>> >> >> > but from what I briefly tested Skeleton seems to work out of the
>> box.
>> >> >> > And it
>> >> >> > doesn't add a *huge* amount of new code. See this simple
>> comparison
>> >> >> > with
>> >> >> > DrGeo:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'Skeleton') systemCategories size. 2
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'Skeleton') classes size. 38
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'Skeleton') methods size. 654
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'Skeleton') linesOfCode. 4765
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'DrGeoII') systemCategories size. 10
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'DrGeoII') classes size. 214
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'DrGeoII') methods size.  1863
>> >> >> > (PackageInfo named: 'DrGeoII') linesOfCode.  17154
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Another issue, I guess, is that if Skeleton gets included someone
>> >> >> > will
>> >> >> > have to maintain it, but from what I've seen the latest version
>> dates
>> >> >> > from
>> >> >> > 2006 and it still works today. So maybe it won't be that big of an
>> >> >> > issue.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Anyway, if you want to test it:
>> >> >> > http://www.languagegame.org:8080/ggame/11.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Cheers,
>> >> >> > Richo
>> >> >>
>> >> >> How does it compare to the data table thing you did in your GSoC
>> >> >> project?
>> >> >
>> >> > My data table serves the only purpose of importing/exporting CSV
>> files,
>> >> > but
>> >> > not much else, whereas Skeleton is a proper spreadsheet, it supports
>> >> > functions, and is well integrated with etoys via drag and drop of
>> tiles.
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Would be nice to have only one, not two table-like objects.
>> >> >
>> >> > I agree, but since my table is not integrated anyway, I vote for
>> >> > integrating
>> >> > Skeleton which is much better than what I did. And if we want the I/O
>> of
>> >> > csv
>> >> > files, I could find the way of adapting Skeleton. It shouldn't be
>> that
>> >> > difficult, I suppose.
>> >> > Cheers,
>> >> > Richo
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> - Bert -
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
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>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
>
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