<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><blockquote type="cite"><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font>Is Bob/Sake project meanwhile with public access? Are you back in <br>Bob/Sake business?<font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#144FAE"><br></font></font></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Sake has always been public access.<br><br><blockquote type="cite"><div><blockquote type="cite">VMMaker is at a far lower level than Seaside or other things <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Metacello is being used for.<br></blockquote><br>Yes, like FFI, ExternalWebBrowsers, SQLite3 or others which <br>are available via configurations. You may say it is overkill for <br>such small projects - but you can construct more complex configs <br>(like Seaside) from that. </div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><br><blockquote type="cite">... You can put scripts into InstallerScripts to be loaded using ...<br></blockquote><br>I know all this - but <br><br> a) I want something that works on Squeak, Pharo, Gemstone, maybe other ST's later<br> (since I use Seaside)<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Well I cant help you there. But it would not be rocket science to port Installer, or sake because they were designed to be minimal. They were designed to be portable to other platforms as an enabling technology.</div><div><br></div><div>Metacello only does one thing, whereas Sake is as general as make in theory.</div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div> b) I want to maintain versions in one file (here in one class)<br> not in separate scripts for each version. I can use Monticello diffs to<br> see how the config has changed, ...<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>This is a design flaw of Metacello, when you have mechanisms like inheritance, </div><div>maintaining one definition for all contexts doesn't work. I have tried it.</div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div> c) I want a declarative description instead of code since I may<br> use it for other purposes too (deployment and dependency tools, ...)<br><br><blockquote type="cite">I could comment on the rest of your post, I basically disagree with <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">pretty much everything you say.<br></blockquote><br>No problem for me ... you dont have to use it. <br>It doesnt change anything on VMMaker or prevents you from using<br>other loaders/installers.<br><br><blockquote type="cite">Can Metacello publish and use definitions on a web page or wiki, can <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">it load from squeakmap, or universes, can it access published bug <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">fixes, can you override with your own local definitions, can it <br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">bootstrap from the source.st code inside a monticello package.<br></blockquote><br>Again: Metacello does not care about SqueakMap, Universe, Mantis<br> since it is not bound to Squeak. You compare apples with oranges.<br><br>Lets play a short game: <br><br>You will find ConfigurationOfMetaSource in the MetaSource project on SqS,<br>that is able to load a whole seaside app right from a core image<br>and keep it maintained with new versions.<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Sake/Packages does all that.<br><div><br></div><div>(Package named: 'Seaside') latest load.</div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div>Show me that Installer/Sake/Bob is doing better here and is aligned <br>with the goals in a) b) and c) <br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Sake uses fully declarative desriptions.</div><br></div>Keith</body></html>