<div dir="ltr">Hi Phil,<div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 12:31 AM, <a href="mailto:phil@highoctane.be">phil@highoctane.be</a> <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:phil@highoctane.be" target="_blank">phil@highoctane.be</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> <br><div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 8:59 AM, Esteban Lorenzano <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:estebanlm@gmail.com" target="_blank">estebanlm@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> <br><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On 17 Oct 2016, at 02:07, Ben Coman <<a href="mailto:btc@openInWorld.com" target="_blank">btc@openInWorld.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="m_8584688827404241292m_-4423052590428945545Apple-interchange-newline"><div><span style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline!important">Phil, Could you outline the steps. Are you doing something other than this...</span><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><a href="https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-vm" style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px" target="_blank">https://github.com/pharo-proje<wbr>ct/pharo-vm</a><br style="font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"></div></blockquote></div><br><div>I think he is talking “in general”, not about the VM in particular. </div><div><br></div></div></blockquote><div>In general. But also about the VM since I wanted to build it for OSX/Win/Linux and CMake + the image code supporting it, while initially a royal PITA (version had to be correct etc) proved to be very useful for a lot of things because it was all logical, variables could be set nicely etc.</div><div>The CMake UI also allows to detect for a number of crappy mistakes, so, a godsend.</div><div><br></div><div>It can also generate XCode project files, which is very useful.</div><div><br></div><div>autoconf and makefiles, no thanks. </div><div> </div><div>The image side CMake support looks great to me, better than the VMMaker green UI, which well, let's keep it at that.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>That tool is not used to generate VM source.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><div>It also working nice with a CI server, so why use stoneage tooling when you have a more modern one available?</div><div><br></div><div>Learn the damn CMake and profit. We want a great VM, let's use great tools.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>There is agreement amongst the CogVM builders that</div><div>- we will use cake or autoconf to generate a cogConfig.h that describes the build target platform's capabilities</div><div>- we will /not/ use either autoconf or cake to generate VM makefiles</div><div>- we will write linux makefiles in the style of the windows and mac makefiles, all using gmake</div><div><br></div><div>We are not using bad tools; cake and autoconf are all useful in their place, but experience has shown that they are not good tools for generating the makefiles we use to build the VM, primarily because they are slow, being painful to run on each make, and because they are higher-order, so figuring out what input to change to achieve a changed output is indirect, and may require a build step (running autoconf/cmake). The makefiles we have for windows and mac are much better; they are fast, running immediately, and direct, their configuration options never depend on rebuilding the make system, only in their configuration files (<a href="http://plugins.int">plugins.int</a>,plugins.ext and attendant platforms/foo/plugins/Makefile files).</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>HTH</div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div>Phil<br></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div></div><div>Esteban</div><div><br></div><div>(there you go, with content stripped as Tim like :P)</div></div><br></blockquote></div><br></div></div>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><span style="font-size:small;border-collapse:separate"><div>_,,,^..^,,,_<br></div><div>best, Eliot</div></span></div></div></div>
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