squeakland December 2004

squeakland@lists.squeakfoundation.org

22 participants
24 discussions

animation, holder
by Randy Heiland 14 Feb '05

14 Feb '05

Hi Squeakers! I just went to Squeakland, downloaded updates, and was experimenting with creating a simple animation - per the "Powerful Ideas..." book and Squeakfest tutorial. It seems there is no longer a "Holder's playerAtCursor" tile in a Holder's viewer. Is that true? What do I do? I was pleased to see that dropping frames into the Holder is no longer plagued with the annoying problem of having to put the cursor in "just the right position". In fact, it seems that the behavior of a Holder is more dynamic than what I remember from Squeakfest, in that it resizes according to how many frames you drop in and allows for easy rearranging of frames - or maybe those features were already there and I didn't realize it. Although I didn't really push it, I'm wondering, if I drop in so many frames that the Holder exceeds the size of my world/screen, will the Holder automatically reveal scrollbars? (It would be nice :) Thanks, Randy

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RE: [Squeakland] Where can I find a description of make siblings
by Dreyfuss Pierre-André (EDU) 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

Hi, There are projects like snake eating stars for which sibling is the best solution and other for instance making traffic light, for which duplicate is necessary. Just take an ellipse and make a script on giving a bright red color to the ellipse and off giving a dark red. To get the yellow light, make a copy. Now you just have to change the red color by the yellow one in the two scripts. The kids are very surprised that now their onld red light is magically turned to a yellow one if the copy is a sibling one. For me the best solution is to have by default a duplicate halo and by clicking with the shift key down to get a sibling. For kids or common user, it seems to me that the idea that a copied object is doing the same things that the original one because the scripts are copied too and are the same. This inducing the idea to get a copy and just change the color in the scripts, this is only working with duplicate. For a programmer making an instance is more economic, specialy if we have to make a lot of instances. All that to say we need both. We need an easy way to make our choice and we have to choose the most intuitive one as default. Parts bin are making duplicate. But the Make button for connectors is making sibling. Saying this, I just get the idea that objects get a check box saying if they have to be copied as duplicate or as sibling. This way part bin will be able to create either sibling or duplicate depending of the future use of the object. This will be coherent with the actual behavior, just the check box will change when the object is getting a script. And last but not least the duplicate as default beeing a preference of E-toy friendly. Best regards -----Message d'origine----- De: squeakland-bounces(a)squeakland.org A: stéphane ducasse; Scott Wallace Cc: squeakland(a)squeakland.org Date: 27.12.04 17:25 Objet: Re: [Squeakland] Where can I find a description of make siblings Hi Folks -- Actually, this is all being thought through once again as we try to design and build the "Omniuser Authoring System" of which the next version of the kids' etoys system should be a subset. I think that copy actions are too cavalier on the one hand, and classes are too top down and rigid on the other. We need something in between these two extremes. E.g. I would like to be able to "promote" an example player to being a "source" for instances. I think this will call for several UI changes, including ways to mark and find the "sources". Ideas? Cheers, Alan At 06:34 AM 12/26/2004, stéphane ducasse wrote: >Hi scott > >I digested quite well your explanation (in fact this was what I thought). > >I was always thinking that halo actions would not contain copy *and* make >a sibling. > >>The change made in 3.8 is that once an object has been *scripted*, the >>halo handle seen at the top-right of its halo will now be an olive >>colored handle whose operation makes a sibling-instance rather than a >>deep-copy. > >and in addition this is what confused me. I was looking anymore at halo >actions since I thought that I would get all the time the make-sibling >(and not copy). What pierre-andre was suggesting was to have make-sibling >per default and with with plus green halo copy. this >way you do not have to go into the halo menu mess. > >Stef > >_______________________________________________ >Squeakland mailing list >Squeakland(a)squeakland.org >http://squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland _______________________________________________ Squeakland mailing list Squeakland(a)squeakland.org http://squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland

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drawing on images
by Randy Heiland 27 Dec '04

27 Dec '04

Is there any way to have my (pen down) objects draw over the top of imported images? --Randy

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Where can I find a description of make siblings
by stéphane ducasse 27 Dec '04

27 Dec '04

hi I was showing to a teacher how to use make siblings and we were confused by the behavior. Is there somewhere a description of the difference between copy and make siblings. Apparently the behavior (duplicate) changed between 3.6-3.7 and 3.8. in 3.8 this is now make siblings by default. I checked a bit and it seems that indeed all the siblings are sharing the same behavior and the variables are local to each object. So one teacher asked me how to get back the default copy behavior I browsed in the halos menus but I could not find that anymore. So what is the status of the makesibling/copy behavior? Is copy simply deprecated (which makes sense to me). Stef

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Keyboard support for eToys?
by Marcus Denker 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

[resend, the first mail was lost somehow...] Hi, On the german list the question came up about etoys and keyboard support. Is it possible to e.g. control the car with the keyboard? I searched the list, and in 2002 Karl Ramberg posted an enhancement (etoy keystroke.5.cs). Has this (or something similar) been added to etoys in the meantime? Another interesting question we got on the list (by a very motivated teacher): How to extend eToys. The teacher would like to build an eToy based environment for teaching math to older kids, and he would like to provide some pre-defined tiles. I think this view of eToys as a framework for building curriculums is quite interesting, but there is no documentation about how to do "etoy" Metaprogramming... Marcus

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[Squeakland] [BUG] destroying a tile inside a script does not change the behavior
by stéphane ducasse 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

Hi In 3.8 (6475) I created a simple script circle turn by move forward when I clicked on it the car performs a circle. Now if I destroy turn by within this script, and click again on the exclamation mark then my car still makes a circle. Now if I add make a sound then my car will go straight and make a sound. Stef

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The Squeak Etoys desktop...
by blake 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

"The Squeak Etoys desktop is mostly bare to make the most room for the children's work and play." How do I set up a Squeak image so that when I child opens it, he gets the Squeak Etoys desktop, and not the usual melange of Squeakianna? Thanks!

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[ODECO]
by stéphane ducasse 22 Dec '04

22 Dec '04

hi all in odeco (not jasmine) it seems that the weight of a ball is linked to its size. Is there a way to create light large bubble such as bubble soap flying in the wind. Stef You can find really intriguing projects using ODECO at http://p7app.geneve.ch:8090/squeak/

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RE: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore
by Arvind Grover 16 Dec '04

16 Dec '04

Scott, you are a miracle worker. It worked like a charm. Thanks a lot for your help. My students will be thrilled that they can make updates to their project and actually save them when they are done. Especially helpful with the end of the semester coming up. arvind ------------------------------------------------------------------ arvind s grover Acting Director of Educational Technology The Hewitt School 45 East 75th St New York, NY 10021 T. (212)288-1919 x613 F. (212)639-9366 E. agrover(a)hewittschool.org W. www.hewittschool.org ------------------------------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: Scott Wallace [mailto:scott.wallace@squeakland.org] Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2004 12:41 AM To: Arvind Grover Cc: squeakland(a)squeakland.org; Kim.Rose(a)squeakland.org; Michael Rueger Subject: RE: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore Hi again, Arvind. Sorry it's taken so long to track this down, but I think I now (finally) have a good fix for this student's damaged project and others like it. Please try out the attached, which (if it passes the smoke test) will find its way into the squeakland update stream before long. To test it, follow the instructions as for the previous fileout I sent out on Monday, which should be discarded. After installing the new fileout, your student will find that she can load in her old project, request "attempt misc. repairs" from the "authoring tools" menu, then republish her project, and the resulting new .pr file should be fine to load into any Squeakland image whether it yet has this fix in it or not. Please let me know how this flies... Cheers, -- Scott At 1:55 AM -0800 12/14/04, Scott Wallace wrote: >Hi, Arvin, > >The fileout I sent earlier had a bug, which accounts for the error >you ran into after loading it. > >I've now got a fixed version of my fileout. But there's still >something wacky, in that when you republish a project that has the >bogus scripts stripped, they reappear. Tracking this down has >eluded me tonight, but I'll attack it again tomorrow. > >Meantime, the seemingly-somewhat-improved state of that project >(after republishing it after loading my early, buggy fileout and >then doing "attempt misc repairs") is actually still not good >enough, in that the project-file it creates will still require an >image that has my fixes in it to be usable. > >So please hold off on this for another little while and hopefully >I'll be able to sort this out soon. > >Cheers,, > > -- Scott > >At 10:18 PM -0500 12/13/04, Arvind S. Grover wrote: >>Scott, I really appreciate the help. I tried the patch you sent me, and >>when I tried misc repairs, it crashed. But, then when I tried >>publishing, it took a while, and told me: >> >>"Some block(s) which reference instance variables are included in this >>segment. These may fail when the segment is loaded if the class has been >>reshaped. What would you like to do?" >> >>I could choose keep going or stop and take a look. When I choose keep >>going, it seems to publish normally, but always asks whenever I want to >>publish. I am not sure exactly what I am looking for when I choose take >>a look. >> >>If this is the best we can get this project, is will be just fine. It >>have anything to add, please let me know. I attached the original .pr >>file. Again, I can't thank you enough for the help. >> >>arvind >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Scott Wallace [mailto:scott.wallace@squeakland.org] >>Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 9:08 PM >>To: Arvind S. Grover >>Cc: squeakland(a)squeakland.org; Michael Rueger; Kim.Rose(a)squeakland.org >>Subject: Re: FW: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore >> >>Hi, Arvind, >> >>Apparently this project had gotten into an inconsistent state >>sometime before the publishing was attempted. >> >>Since you mentioned that you've tried to publish the same project on >>more than one computer, and encountered the same problem, I wonder >>*what* you copied from computer to computer for the successive >>trials. Was it an earlier version of the .pr project file that *had* >>been successfully published? Or did you copy over the >>squeakPlugIn.image from one machine to the next? >> >>If you still to have a saved copy of the image in which this error >>occurred, please try this: >> >>(1) Place the attached file into the "My Squeak" folder on the >>computer that has the Squeak image with the offending project. >>(2) Start up the image that has the error. >>(3) "Install" the attached file from a filelist (hit shift-esc to >>get the world menu, choose "open", then "file-list"; select the file >>and then hit the "install" button.) >>(4) Choose "attempt misc repairs" from the "authoring tools" menu >>(hit shift-esc to get the world menu, then choose "authoring tools", >>then "attempt misc repairs.") >>(5) Now try to publish the project again. >> >>*** Alternatively, if you could by any chance make that image >>available to us on some ftp site, we could download it and take a >>direct look. >> >> >>If the offending image is no longer available for trying this out, of >>course, this won't do your student much good -- sorry. However, >>probably the attached code, or something derived from it, will appear >>in a forthcoming Squeakland update to help work around similar error >>conditions in the future. >> >>Cheers, >> >> -- Scott >> >>PS: If you have no image but do have a previously-successfully-saved >>.pr file for the project, please email *that* to me privately, if you >>can. >> >> >>At 1:04 PM -0500 12/13/04, Arvind S. Grover wrote: >> >Since Michael has been able to correct the attachments issue, I am >>>resending my log attachment. Any help would be appreciated. >>> >>>arvind >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: squeakland-bounces(a)squeakland.org >>>[mailto:squeakland-bounces@squeakland.org] On Behalf Of Arvind S. >>Grover >>>Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 11:25 AM >>>To: squeakland(a)squeakland.org >>>Subject: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore >>> >>>...I have a student who has a 1 megabyte file, and each time she tried to >>>publish, it hangs while publishing. I have attached the log. I have >>>tried on different computers with no luck. >>> >>>Any ideas? Thanks again, >>> >>>arvind

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RE: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore
by Scott Wallace 16 Dec '04

16 Dec '04

Hi again, Arvind. Sorry it's taken so long to track this down, but I think I now (finally) have a good fix for this student's damaged project and others like it. Please try out the attached, which (if it passes the smoke test) will find its way into the squeakland update stream before long. To test it, follow the instructions as for the previous fileout I sent out on Monday, which should be discarded. After installing the new fileout, your student will find that she can load in her old project, request "attempt misc. repairs" from the "authoring tools" menu, then republish her project, and the resulting new .pr file should be fine to load into any Squeakland image whether it yet has this fix in it or not. Please let me know how this flies... Cheers, -- Scott At 1:55 AM -0800 12/14/04, Scott Wallace wrote: >Hi, Arvin, > >The fileout I sent earlier had a bug, which accounts for the error >you ran into after loading it. > >I've now got a fixed version of my fileout. But there's still >something wacky, in that when you republish a project that has the >bogus scripts stripped, they reappear. Tracking this down has >eluded me tonight, but I'll attack it again tomorrow. > >Meantime, the seemingly-somewhat-improved state of that project >(after republishing it after loading my early, buggy fileout and >then doing "attempt misc repairs") is actually still not good >enough, in that the project-file it creates will still require an >image that has my fixes in it to be usable. > >So please hold off on this for another little while and hopefully >I'll be able to sort this out soon. > >Cheers,, > > -- Scott > >At 10:18 PM -0500 12/13/04, Arvind S. Grover wrote: >>Scott, I really appreciate the help. I tried the patch you sent me, and >>when I tried misc repairs, it crashed. But, then when I tried >>publishing, it took a while, and told me: >> >>"Some block(s) which reference instance variables are included in this >>segment. These may fail when the segment is loaded if the class has been >>reshaped. What would you like to do?" >> >>I could choose keep going or stop and take a look. When I choose keep >>going, it seems to publish normally, but always asks whenever I want to >>publish. I am not sure exactly what I am looking for when I choose take >>a look. >> >>If this is the best we can get this project, is will be just fine. It >>have anything to add, please let me know. I attached the original .pr >>file. Again, I can't thank you enough for the help. >> >>arvind >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Scott Wallace [mailto:scott.wallace@squeakland.org] >>Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 9:08 PM >>To: Arvind S. Grover >>Cc: squeakland(a)squeakland.org; Michael Rueger; Kim.Rose(a)squeakland.org >>Subject: Re: FW: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore >> >>Hi, Arvind, >> >>Apparently this project had gotten into an inconsistent state >>sometime before the publishing was attempted. >> >>Since you mentioned that you've tried to publish the same project on >>more than one computer, and encountered the same problem, I wonder >>*what* you copied from computer to computer for the successive >>trials. Was it an earlier version of the .pr project file that *had* >>been successfully published? Or did you copy over the >>squeakPlugIn.image from one machine to the next? >> >>If you still to have a saved copy of the image in which this error >>occurred, please try this: >> >>(1) Place the attached file into the "My Squeak" folder on the >>computer that has the Squeak image with the offending project. >>(2) Start up the image that has the error. >>(3) "Install" the attached file from a filelist (hit shift-esc to >>get the world menu, choose "open", then "file-list"; select the file >>and then hit the "install" button.) >>(4) Choose "attempt misc repairs" from the "authoring tools" menu >>(hit shift-esc to get the world menu, then choose "authoring tools", >>then "attempt misc repairs.") >>(5) Now try to publish the project again. >> >>*** Alternatively, if you could by any chance make that image >>available to us on some ftp site, we could download it and take a >>direct look. >> >> >>If the offending image is no longer available for trying this out, of >>course, this won't do your student much good -- sorry. However, >>probably the attached code, or something derived from it, will appear >>in a forthcoming Squeakland update to help work around similar error >>conditions in the future. >> >>Cheers, >> >> -- Scott >> >>PS: If you have no image but do have a previously-successfully-saved >>.pr file for the project, please email *that* to me privately, if you >>can. >> >> >>At 1:04 PM -0500 12/13/04, Arvind S. Grover wrote: >> >Since Michael has been able to correct the attachments issue, I am >>>resending my log attachment. Any help would be appreciated. >>> >>>arvind >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: squeakland-bounces(a)squeakland.org >>>[mailto:squeakland-bounces@squeakland.org] On Behalf Of Arvind S. >>Grover >>>Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 11:25 AM >>>To: squeakland(a)squeakland.org >>>Subject: [Squeakland] cannot publish a file anymore >>> >>>...I have a student who has a 1 megabyte file, and each time she tried to >>>publish, it hangs while publishing. I have attached the log. I have >>>tried on different computers with no luck. >>> >>>Any ideas? Thanks again, >>> >>>arvind

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squeakland December 2004