[Seaside] Ideas worth stealing

[stephane ducasse]

I understand. The message was not only for you :)

Stef

On Jun 2, 2008, at 2:43 AM, Todd Blanchard wrote:

> Ah, please don't get me wrong.  I don't actually like RoR.  I find  
> Ruby's syntax to be confusing and pointlessly complex.  OTOH, it has  
> the right mix of stuff for the mission and I'm getting more  
> comfortable with it.  But I still don't really like it.
>
> I do independent software development from my home.  I cater to  
> small businesses - largely because nobody else does and they need  
> software too.  These clients are very sensitive to price and time to  
> delivery.
>
> I select the technology stack for each project based on the needs of  
> the client.  I'm just explaining why Seaside hasn't been getting  
> picked.  There are things I or my clients need that it just doesn't  
> have.  A good CRUD story on mysql is one of them.  Documentation is  
> another.  Deployment is a third (although I remain hopeful for GLASS).
>
> When I make contributions to software projects, it is usually in the  
> context of a project.  I'll solve problems in the context of  
> whatever I'm working in.  I'd love to take the time out to  
> contribute to Seaside but if I'm not using it, I'm not likely to be  
> able to do it.
>
> It doesn't help that my septic system packed it up this spring and I  
> have to pay for a replacement - I'm not turning down any work this  
> year and I'm short of spare cycles to give away.  Usually I take the  
> summer off to do whatever I like. :-(
>
> So, short answer - I would love to dive in and crack this nut - but  
> I don't have the resources to do it right now.
>
> On Jun 1, 2008, at 12:25 PM, Conrad Taylor wrote:
>
>> Hi Todd, the tools within Smalltalk are many years ahead of the  
>> tools the exist in the RoR.  However, they are starting to get  
>> better with projects like Rubinious and MagLev.  Also, please don't  
>> get me wrong because I do like RoR and that's one of the languages  
>> that I use on a regular basis.  Next, please remember that Seaside  
>> is open source as well as the ActiveScaffold plugin that you  
>> mention.  Thus, the Smalltalk community is always looking for  
>> people to build and architect various API to make system better.   
>> Are you interested in building such a component for Seaside?  It  
>> would be great if you are because it could benefit the entire  
>> community.
>>
>> -Conrad
>>
>> On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 4:04 PM, Todd Blanchard  
>> <tblanchard at mac.com> wrote:
>> I watched the screencast.  It is not the same thing.  I think you  
>> guys are missing something key in that project of yours.
>>
>> Active scaffold simply lets me point the app at a db and ZAM total  
>> admin UI that looks nice with AJAX master detail editing.  I can  
>> then filter out attributes that people ought not to edit, apply  
>> permissions, and decorate the app with task links.
>>
>> The demo shows app development.  I didn't develop a thing apart  
>> from specify some mappings because the database used weird and  
>> inconsistent naming conventions.
>>
>> I also found it interesting that the app being developed in the  
>> screencast didn't look nearly as sophisticated as the tools being  
>> used to build it.  I don't find that a good selling point.
>>
>> -Todd Blanchard
>>
>>
>> On May 30, 2008, at 4:28 AM, James Robertson wrote:
>>
>> Cincom is doing exactly that - combining the ActiveRecord pattern  
>> with scaffolding.  Have a look here:
>>
>> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/userblogs/mls/blogView?showComments=true&printTitle=WebVelocity_alpha_screencast&entry=3388846573
>>
>> James Robertson
>> Cincom Smalltalk Product Evangelist
>> http://www.cincomsmalltalk.com/blog/blogView
>> Talk Small and Carry a Big Class Library
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 30, 2008, at 3:13 AM, Todd Blanchard wrote:
>>
>> With the idea that no good idea should go un-stolen, allow me to  
>> introduce seaside fans to active scaffold http://activescaffold.com.
>>
>> I am wrapping up a ruby on rails engagement with a client and  
>> discovered this framework.  I ended up using ROR because the client  
>> had an existing mysql database and Squeak's mysql support isn't so  
>> hot where rails is all about mysql, and I had only a couple "flows"  
>> but a whole lot of plain old admin-CRUD to do and rails excels at  
>> plain crud on mysql.  With activescaffold - I had to write very  
>> little code for the admin UI - a major plus because this project is  
>> on a very tight timeline.
>>
>> Anyhow, activescaffold works with activerecord and infers a really  
>> slick AJAX UI that supports sensible CRUD more or less instantly.   
>> Once installed, you can go through and customize views by adding  
>> actions links, filtering columns, and generally overriding bits of  
>> logic to make it more task focused.
>>
>> It would be really cool to have a similar facility in Seaside.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Todd Blanchard
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