On Tue, Apr 01, 2003 at 05:00:23PM +0200, Marcus Denker wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 01, 2003 at 09:42:11AM -0500, Joshua 'Schwa' Gargus wrote:
> > You raise a very important issue since there is a real possibility
> > that, in the future, the entertainment console will serve as the
> > family computer for many households around the world.  It would be a
> > shame if Squeak cannot be made available to millions (if not billions)
> > of people due to DRM.
> >
> 
> The problem is: Sony and Microsoft are actually loosing money with
> each sale of the hardware. 

I've heard that Sony has been making money off of the PS2 for some
time now, although they were sold for a loss for some time after their
introduction.  I haven't been able to find numbers describing how much
is made/lost on hardware sales alone over the 5 year lifetime of a
typical console.  

> The whole gaming-console industry works only because the
> hardware-manufacturers are getting money back from *every* game
> sold.

You're saying that the problem is inherent in the console business
model; I agree.  That doesn't mean that there is not a serious problem
if the console replaces the PC, and Squeak can't be provided for free
to families around the world.

It seems wrong that Microsoft is allowed to engineer a business
situation that locks out Squeak, Linux, and other free software.
Especially since they have already been found guilty of abusing their
monopoly power.  (I also think that the concept of "monopoly" might
need to be tweaked or supplemented, since although neither Microsoft
nor Sony has a monopoly on the console market, the impact of DRM on
free software is just as great as if there were a monopoly).

> As soon as you would allow people to start Squeak on a XBox or Playstation, 
> they could load Squeak programms over the network.
> (e.g. multiuser games implemented in Croquet) *without paying the tax*. 

If there were some way to make sure that only free Squeak programs
could run, then I don't see a problem with legislating that console
makers allow this.  I agree that it would not be fair if commercial
developers could use this as a loophole to make money off the console
without paying the console maker.

> 
> Getting Squeak to run on such a system is not the real problem, e.g.
> Squeak has allready been ported to the PS2... 

The PS2 doesn't have DRM.  This won't be so easy on the PS3.

Joshua


> 
>     Marcus
> 
> 
> -- 
> Marcus Denker marcus at ira.uka.de  -- Squeak! http://squeak.de
>