Andreas Raab <andreas.raab at gmx.de> wrote:
> > > What I feel _really_ unhappy about is the complete absence 
> > > of any vision (and action) which goes beyound "hack it up in
> > > small bits".
> >
> > Well, that *is* the strategy. One I'm all in favour of. 
> 
> You are confirming my worst fears.
> 
> With not a single thought being put into the "rich personal multimedia
> environment" part? 
Well, not a serious drive for it by me.

> And you think that this will work (yeah, maybe for a year
> or two). You're going to end up as a competitor of any of the other
> scripting languages, just not a good one.
> 
> > The end result for 3.7 should be that the default download image
> > (kitchensink, in cdegrootspeak) from Squeak.org should look 
> > *exactly* as it looks now
> 
> Just my problem. It will look *exactly* the same for the next ten years if
> there isn't any vision about where to go.
>
> Ah, shoot. Why am I even writing this. The battle is lost anyways. There is
> simply nothing I can do convince the guides that the media (and many other)
> stuff is as important as any of the other activities.
Of course it is important as the other activities. Just not to us
specifically. 

You keep avoiding the fact that stuff can be (now) pursued
independently, via SM. I don't know why. Do you think that the small
portion of media stuff that actually has to be a patch in the image is
critical? fine, then say that, and do something about it. Review stuff,
push for it (as you did now). If we don't agree, convince us. If we
simply don't get to harvesting it because we're busy, you harvest it.
I'm sure this doesn't have to clash with our goals and methods. You can
take over building the official media image (we eventually want, but
none of is particularly rushing to actually do) - use the same core,
preload the packages you care about, and distribute that, right
alongside the "basic" we'll be moving towards. If you make sure to work
in a compatible way, the sharing will increase.

> At least it is now
> clear to me that the original vision of Squeak is really dead today. "Thank
> you" for making this so utterly obvious.
I don't think it's dead. It's is exactly as live as the people that care
about it make it. It is not the vision itself that is different now, the
model of governance is different. You can push your vision. Don't expect
me to.

Daniel