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Hi,


Am Dienstag, 27.05.03 um 06:10 Uhr schrieb Alan Kay:

> Thanks Andrew --
>
> Cheers,
>
> Alan
>

Thanks from me too, Andrew and the others. Of course I will contact the 
authors, and I also will have a look, if there are already  some 
comercial products there. (BTW,  the point of interest are 
visualization techniques for source code, described in IEEE Computer 
Graphics & Visualization somewhere between 1995-1997)

Thanks all.

Hans

> -----
>
> At 8:09 PM -0400 5/26/03, Andrew C. Greenberg wrote:
>> That would be too reasonable to expect of a Federal statute, Alan. 
>> Alas, the Patent Act generally proscribes ANY practicing of a patent 
>> during the term, whether commercial or not (Making, using, selling, 
>> offering for sale).  The only interesting question is whether the 
>> conduct infringes -- not whether it was "goodie, goodie" enough to 
>> avoid liability.
>>
>> That said, there is case law supporting an "experimental use" or 
>> "fair use" exception.  An interesting article on the subject can be 
>> found at:
>>
>> 	http://www.idea.piercelaw.edu/articles/30/p243.Grossman.pdf
>>
>> This exception is not very well-developed or clear, perhaps at the 
>> level of the initial fair use case under the 1909 Act case law (which 
>> recognized a fair use exception without a statute).
>>
>> On Monday, May 26, 2003, at 08:39 PM, Alan Kay wrote:
>>
>>> I don't think you have infringed the patent. But now I'm not so 
>>> sure. I think there used to be a provision that individuals could 
>>> make a single version of anything for their own use (Andrew?).
>>>
>>> I think that the patent stuff is supposed to prevent competition for 
>>> sale of ideas and technologies, but it doesn't prevent people making 
>>> onesies for themselves.
>>>
>>> There is a different but related notion of "fair use" in copyright 
>>> law. One of the things that is most under attack right now is "fair 
>>> use" and what it means -- and indeed what patents and copyrights 
>>> actually mean these days.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>> ------
>>>
>>>  At 5:57 PM -0400 5/26/03, Rick McGeer wrote:
>>>> Alan,
>>>> Of course, one should always attribute.  But there is another 
>>>> question here. Suppose somebody patents a structure or protocol 
>>>> without implementing it.  I independently discover the thing, or 
>>>> something closely related, and implement it to see how it works in 
>>>> practice, how it fits with existing stuff, etc.  In the tradition 
>>>> of scientific publication, I want not only to write up the results 
>>>> but also release the source so others can play with the idea, 
>>>> experiment, extend, etc.  I've got no interest in selling the thing 
>>>> or exploiting it commercially.  Question: have I infringed the 
>>>> patent, am I liable for damages, etc?  It would be really nasty to 
>>>> get sued for writing a paper...
>>>> Best,
>>>> Rick.
>>>> Alan Kay writes:
>>>>> I don't think you do need the agreement. But it is the tradition 
>>>>> of science to always give attribution to the creators of the 
>>>>> ideas. So "use and attribute".
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Alan
>>>>> -----
>>>>> At 7:08 PM +0200 5/25/03, Hans Nikolaus Beck wrote:
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>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>> if I want to implement  an algorithm or visualization technique 
>>>>>> in an open source project  (in fact: squeak) which was presented 
>>>>>> in a public paper (in this case IEEE Computer Graphics & 
>>>>>> Visualization), do I need the agreement of the authors ? That's a 
>>>>>> question related to the current situation of software patents and 
>>>>>> copyright as given by law of USA.  My feeling says: I need the 
>>>>>> agreement.
>>>>>> Greetings
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hans
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>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Rick McGeer           Ph: (925) 254-2524
>>>> 50 Diablo View Road  FAX: (925) 253-0623
>>>> Orinda, CA, 94563    Cell: (510) 334-6004
>>>> eMail: rick at mcgeer.com
>>>> Yahoo IM: rickmcgeer
>>>> MSN IM: rickmcgeer at hotmail.com
>>>> AOL IM: rick mcgeer 1
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>
>
> -- 
>
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