Hi steve

I partially agree with you but someone should evaluate the fix/enh
and if nobody do it there is no magic.
I think that the effort of goran, doug and marcus , cees are valuable
they are trying to put in place a process so that enh are reviewed.

Stef


On 16 févr. 05, at 5:32, Stephan B.Wessels wrote:

> I wonder how many Smalltalker's I've met who used to do a lot more 
> work in Squeak but have either given up and gone onto something else 
> or decided to avoid the mailing list, etc.?
>
> I know of individuals that fit into one or more of these:
> 	- frustrated that bugs posted to the mailing list are still in the 
> product after 4 years
> 	- frustrated that worthy features published to the list are ignored
> 	- frustrated with how a lot of things are just not finished
> 	- frustrated with an appearance of an "in crowd" that decides where 
> the group as a whole focuses (although I do not applaud committee 
> based design)
>
> Okay, so I really love Squeak.  I truly believe it's the future of 
> Smalltalk.  I use Squeak every day.  Further, we have some of the 
> finest minds in OO working either on or with Squeak.  How can we go 
> wrong?
>
> However, I do not grasp how this activity furthers any real growth in 
> Squeak.
>
> I'll keep an open mind but my first reaction is to speak up and say 
> "wait a second".  Help me to understand better why this is good thing.
>
> Cheers,
>   - Steve
>
> On Feb 15, 2005, at 6:40 AM, goran.krampe at bluefish.se wrote:
>
>> Hi fellow Squeakers!
>>
>> Pour yourself a cup of coffee, grab hold of your keyboard and read the
>> rest of this posting - even if it *is* long. Ok? :)
>>
>> 	"Are we rising again?" "No. On the contrary." "Are we descending?"
>> "Worse than that, captain!
>> 	we are falling!" "For Heaven's sake heave out the ballast!" "There! 
>> the
>> last sack is empty!"
>> 	"Does the balloon rise?" "No!" "I hear a noise like the dashing of
>> waves. The sea is below the
>> 	car! It cannot be more than 500 feet from us!" "Overboard with every
>> weight! . . .
>> 	everything!"
>>
>> Thus starts chapter 1, "Dropped from the clouds", of the book "The
>> Mysterious Island" by Jules Verne. The Mysterious Island follows the
>> adventures of a group of five castaways who use their survivalist 
>> savvy
>> to build a functional community on an uncharted, faraway, fantastic
>> island of bewildering goings-on.
>>
>> Our sacred balloon is also in trouble. We need to loose weight because
>> we are drowning in endless debates and non functional processes. We 
>> need
>> to get a good lightweight leadership in place. This island, the 
>> future,
>> is also full of wonders but still largely uncharted. Can we succeed in
>> building a functional community? Yes, we can. So, "dropped from the
>> clouds", we will try:
>>
>> The Castaways
>> -----------------
>>
>> The last six days there has been some off list activity in forming a 
>> new
>> leadership for Squeak. Yes, you read it right - the Guides are now
>> *officially retired*. From this point and forward there is a new
>> *temporary* group consisting of five castawa... eh people, that now
>> leads Squeak:
>>
>> 	- Göran Krampe
>> 	- Doug Way
>> 	- Cees de Groot
>> 	- Marcus Denker
>> 	- Michael Rueger
>>
>> This group reads squeak-dev of course, but is also reachable at:
>>
>> 	mysterious-island at discuss.squeakfoundation.org
>>
>> We are *leading* the Squeak community, not guiding. Well, that was the
>> summary, you have questions? That's odd. :) Read on.
>>
>>
>> Questions and Answers
>> --------------------------
>>
>> Q: How on earth did this happen? :)
>>
>> Well, very sudden. I (Göran) got a sudden urge/jolt/whatever six days
>> ago and just ran with the ball. This is NOT a reaction against the
>> current ongoing SqF formation (see below) - in fact - it is rather the
>> opposite.
>>
>> Q: How does this relate to the Squeakfoundation formation going on?
>>
>> First of all, only some of you know (not publicly announced yet, so I 
>> am
>> spilling the beans here) that there is a SqueakFoundation formation
>> process recently started. It aims to put a real foundation in place 
>> with
>> capacity of real funding etc and this work continues. A lot of people
>> are involved in that process and we have high hopes for it.
>>
>> Us five castaways are not leading that process, Stephane Ducasse and
>> Michael Rueger are (Michael is in our group too, but whatever). The 
>> idea
>> is that the castaways is temporarily in charge, *until* and *if* SqF
>> delivers a scheme for forming a new leadership. When and how that will
>> happen, we do not know.
>>
>> Also note that everyone in this group is actively participating in the
>> SqF formation. Finally, we think forming this leadership will help the
>> SqF formation a lot - because now there is a group leading that can 
>> take
>> decisions and implement suggestions, and pave the way forward.
>>
>> Q: Who gave you permission to do this "coup" you sneaky bastards!?
>>
>> Noone did, because before today there was no decisional body or forum
>> that could grant it to us! This is the first step - an interim group
>> that stands up, takes charge and leads. One important thing though - 
>> the
>> former Guides and Stephane Ducasse (leading the SqF formation process)
>> stands behind this new group and support us.
>>
>> We are also all dedicated to the community - and you who know who we 
>> are
>> can attest to that. This is NOT some "hostile takeover" of any kind. 
>> We
>> are doing this hoping for ALL your support and we expect to not let 
>> you
>> down. We are putting ourselves on the line here. We are taking on the
>> responsibility and hope we can deliver.
>>
>> Q: Why aren't the other three guides in the group?
>>
>> This is a group specifically focused on community decision-making,
>> building consensus etc. Ned, Craig and Tim (the former guides not in
>> this new group) are all top notch Squeak developers but they are quite
>> busy doing what they do best - cranking out cool code. And this group
>> both needs to be rejuvenated and to be small. Ned, Craig and Tim or
>> anyone else will get their chance of being in this group in the 
>> future,
>> since we are only grabbing a temporary "mandate".
>>
>> Q: What does temporary mean exactly?
>>
>> We don't know. 6 months, a year? We will see. But it IS temporary in 
>> any
>> case, if SqF hasn't formed a replacement scheme - then we will solve 
>> it
>> some other way, like for example by putting a new group in place.
>>
>> Q: What is this group called? Mysterious Island is a bit long...
>>
>> Yeah. :) Castaways? Settlers? Silly-sods-taking-all-the-crap? Hehe, 
>> you
>> decide.
>>
>> Q: What happens now?
>>
>> In day-to-day practice not much revolutionary will happen immediately.
>> Things continue mostly like before - but there are a few big 
>> differences
>> in how the community will operate:
>>
>> 	- Decisions that needs to be made for Squeak will in the end be made 
>> by
>> us. Of course, the discussions are as open as always right here on
>> squeak-dev, and we are not claiming to know everything - people with 
>> the
>> knowledge still affect the process just like always. In fact, this is
>> more of a responsibility than anything else. We take the 
>> responsibility
>> to make the decisions instead of just having discussions turning into
>> endless debate.
>>
>> 	- You can always ask us. Since we now make the decisions and thus,
>> consequentially, form the direction forward for Squeak - we should be
>> able to answer any questions with authority. This helps the community 
>> a
>> lot.
>>
>> 	- Any and all Squeak issues should be discussed just like before, on
>> squeak-dev. Yes, we do have the private list mentioned above - but it
>> will not contain any discussion except for when we think it is needed 
>> to
>> do it privately. The Guides did everything openly. We do not and we
>> require at least a small private forum in order to operate well.
>>
>> Other than that, the plans haven't been made yet. We have promised to
>> take a good look at the roadmap Stephane has presented and will 
>> probably
>> do that as one of our first tasks. And all the other things going on 
>> at
>> this moment continues as before, like the restarted partitioning of 
>> the
>> image etc.
>>
>> How we will organize within our group, with roles and how decisions 
>> are
>> tracked etc, well, we haven't decided yet. But from now on you can use
>> mysterious-island at discuss.squeakfoundation.org to reach all of us. 
>> More
>> on that later.
>>
>> So if you want to alert us and make sure your issue isn't drowning in
>> squeak-dev, use the above. We are of course all reading squeak-dev, 
>> but
>> sometimes the traffic can be intense and CCing to the above will make
>> sure we can filter it out.
>>
>> If anyone has additional questions - feel free to just reply to this
>> posting (on squeak-dev) and we will try hard to answer. :)
>>
>> regards, Göran Krampe on behalf of the castaways
>>
>>
> --
> Simple things should be simple. Complex things should be possible.
>   - alan kay
>