On 07.08.2006, at 22:36, stéphane ducasse wrote:

>
> On 7 août 06, at 19:55, Andreas Raab wrote:
>
>> stéphane ducasse wrote:
>>>> For the abstractions and tools: Sure, we don't have the perfect  
>>>> solution for these issues. But how about dealing with the parts  
>>>> that are utterly trivial to deal with? Like, for example, why  
>>>> not immediately remove all the packages that have almost no  
>>>> further dependencies, like: FFI, Speech, Nebraska, Sound, OB?
>>> We will try to remove what can be remove easily:
>>>     FFI, Speech, Nebraska (sound I do not know),
>>>     and declare that the mini image.
>>

I vote against doing this so extremely late in beta. FFI is ok, it  
has no dependencies. But I don't have the time and energy to do the  
rest in 3.9.... alpha is alpha, beta is beta.
There was a time when we could have done this easily (in alpha).

But it's so much easier to wait and then critizise... it's especially  
good for getting people to invest time and have a great communit, I'm  
sure.

>> That's not what I mean. I don't want to "declare" a mini image -  
>> that's a pointless exercise if we start with the definition that a  
>> mini image contains everything that we can't remove easily.

So this whole discussion started that you said we were actively  
destroying the goal of modularising Squeak just by not releasing an  
bigger and a small version... how is that different? What
Stef suggested would get you back what you wanted: A big and a  
slightly small version, I guess as kind of a symbolic statement, just  
like we would have if we would do a "full" version that
is 3.9 + vmmaker + yaxo + webbrowser.

And now you call it a "pointless exercise". Maybe it was not such a  
bad idea to not to have "full" and "basic" for 3.9 as I suggested? I  
never suggested to stop making the parts
less dependend of each other, I only said that it makes no sense to  
ship a "full" image for 3.9. You know, "pointless exercise".

>> The whole point of making headway towards modularity is that step  
>> by step we decrease dependencies. As such, removing the above is  
>> useful if and only if it is seen as a stepping stone for the next  
>> version (which will hopefully remove even more) not as an end-goal.

This was the idea: Work slowly, steadily towards it, as time allows.

      Marcus
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