Meeting with Edgar notes
Matthew Fulmer
tapplek at gmail.com
Sat Feb 2 14:10:54 UTC 2008
On Fri, Feb 01, 2008 at 08:05:25PM -0300, Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
> TO ALL:
>
> Just we meet with Matthew and some words with Craig.
> I also see Steph and Andreas sending feedback here or in release team
> list.
Edgar and I met for 30 minutes this morning and discussed what a
3.11 based on 3.8.2 would look like, how to get there, and how
one could have the best of both changesets and packages for
the release process:
- Porting the 3.9 and 3.10 fixes back to changesets would be the
best way to ensure the sanity of the release team. Edgar says
the tool World > Open > PackageList could keep the image
modular without MC loaded. I'm not sure how this works, but
sounds interesting
- If we did that, how would we generate these change-sets? Edgar
says an experimental branch using DeltaStreams in parallel
with change sets may be useful, but we didn't discuss it much.
My comments about the meeting:
- A deltaStream-based update stream would be a good experiment,
but DeltaStreams doesn't yet have a script to generate diff's
from MCZ packages. However, I have made one before (as part of
my SqueakSource commit emails project) that we could use to
partially automate this conversion.
- DeltaStreams would be usable for this task, but not much so.
But this would only be an experiment. I don't see DeltaStreams
making the task of release easier for some time yet,
especially as the file-out format is still
not-forward-compatible binary, and no "subscription" mechanism
exists yet in DS, due to it's alpha status. However, the core
mechanism of change-model and SystemEditor is pretty stable,
and is due for a stress test; this would be a good stress test
- I don't want to give you the impression that we are going to
abandon the 3.10 release. Keith and I would like to maintain
it via LPF just as much as Edgar wants to make 3.11 out of
3.8.2. I would like there to be two 3.11 releases: one with
traits and the other without. This just didn't arise in the
meeting
>
> It's important we reach some agree for next 3.11.
> We only exchange ideas , trying to see the best road to follow.
>
> I repeat my vision.
>
> One day I wish to have a very small and smart thing.
> I open workspace and say "Pier" and all loads and I in bussiness.
>
> Maria wish play "DressTheDoll" with Etoys, then she type DressTheDoll (and
> the thing only loads the needed to she).
>
> Some talented music (many Squeakers ) choose the last Stephane Rollandin
> have and voila, he is doing jazz, tango or Nepal music (and not load Etoys
> or Web)
>
> Sure many more examples.
>
> Now we have 3.10 , some just discover could load several things automatic,
> some don't know 3.10 lack some packages living outside the base image.
>
> 3.11 could cut more packages and load again if needed.
>
> The goal is going closer to MinimalMorphic.
> Then to Kernel.
> Then to Spoon.
>
> I apologize if Craig or Pavel think different, sure they could explain
> better.
>
> The point is if we should start from 3.8.2 (without Traits and Monticello)
> or we should continue from 3.10 is now.
>
> The tentative image I put in ftp is only a first prototype idea and was
> 3.10.
>
> But some believe could have sense do some similar from 3.8.2
> Kind of 3.10 without Monticello and Traits.
>
> So we listen all ideas, wait all help.
>
> ========
> Next meeting is scheduled tomorrow 2 February 2008 on IRC
>
> 8:00 Phoenix 16:00 Rosario 13:00 Europa
>
> ======
>
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--
Matthew Fulmer -- http://mtfulmer.wordpress.com/
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