[squeak-dev] Re: Are Objects really hard?

Janko Mivšek janko.mivsek at eranova.si
Mon Feb 27 11:37:11 UTC 2012

Hi guys,

Just to conclude this topic: there is a nice talk between Dave Thomas
(of OTI fame where IBM VisualAge Smalltalk and nowadays VA Smalltalk
came out), James Robertson and David Buck in recent Independent

   IM 67: Have Objects Failed Us?

What I like is a discussion about OO vs. relational world and ORM in the
second half, which is also by my opinion the reason why OO didn't
succeed more as it did, and why is considered hard for most of
developers until our days.

Best regards

S, Janko Mivšek piše:
> Hi guys,
> Again one interesting topic for this weekend to discuss. David Nolen, a
> Lisp and JavaScript guy posted in his blog an article titled Illiterate
> Programming [1] where he said:
> "...Yet I think Smalltalk still fundamentally failed (remember this is a
> programming language originally designed to scale from children to
> adults) because *Objects are really hard* and no-one really understands
> to this day how to do them right...."
> He links to Alan Kay post [2] back in 1998 where he talks about problems
> with inheritance:
> "Here are a few problems in the naive inheritance systems we use today:
> confusions of Taxonomy and Parentage, of Specialization and Refinement,
> of Parts and Wholes, of Semantics and Pragmatics..."
> Let we concentrate on broader "Objects are really hard and no-one really
> understands to this day how to do them right" claim and not merely
> inheritance, please.
> Best regards
> Janko
> [1] http://dosync.posterous.com/illiterate-programming
> [2]
> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/1998-April/009261.html

Janko Mivšek
Smalltalk Web Application Server

More information about the Squeak-dev mailing list