Hi Jakob,

I agree with the UI problems you mention about the in-image SqueakMap
client window, but those are just ToolBuilder configuration
superficialities I or someone will eventually fix.  In the meantime, I
adamantly want to reduce the number of places in the IDE where we tell
people to load things from.  For now I've moved them to the Tools
menu, as you suggested.

I also recognize a perception on your part of Squeak and its community
being like the group identified on the home-page of github.com:

    "Built for developers"

so hope you won't mind me reminding that the audience for Squeak goes
beyond that group.  Squeak should continue to cater to Users, because
they're not as tough as Developers.  As a developer, you can
appreciate a modular system capable of loading IDE plug-ins.

> These projects place a Metacello load script in their README files.

I wasn't trying to change you if you have a special use-case or
preference for doing configuration that way.

> Yeah, projects that use Pharo or GemStone as their primary platform will be delighted to hear that they have to maintain a SqueakMap entry to give squeakers a chance to try their stuff. Not!

Of course it's not mandatory, but I think you're kidding yourself if
you think Users (and even Developers) in 2019 will be delighted to
know they have to do a lot of research and work (hint:  a lot more
than 9 clicks) just to figure out how to try out your project.  That's
what SqueakMap was designed to solve:  fixed configurations that
present the project, and work forever on a particular version.  It's
targeted to helping _others besides you_ configure their system so
they can evaluate your project's latest working version to decide if
they want to invest the time in setting up a dev configuration.  But
often others will capture load scripts and document them on SqueakMap
for themselves, you don't have to do it if you don't want.

 - Chris




 - Chris






On Thu, Apr 4, 2019 at 3:22 PM Jakob Reschke <forums.jakob at resfarm.de> wrote:
>
> Am Do., 4. Apr. 2019 um 21:54 Uhr schrieb Jakob Reschke <forums.jakob at resfarm.de>:
>>
>> Am Do., 4. Apr. 2019 um 16:51 Uhr schrieb Tim Johnson <digit at sonic.net>:
>>>
>>>
>>> On Apr 2, 2019, at 3:00 PM, Jakob Reschke wrote:
>>>
>>> > Installing the current incarnation of the refactoring tools might
>>> > be another good candidate for an image initialization shortlist. I
>>> > mostly live without them just because the buttons to install them
>>> > are too many clicks away...
>>>
>>> Where are they?
>>
>>
>> That's part of the guessing game, isn't it? ;-) tl;dr: the "Refactoring Tools" are on the SqueakMap for Squeak 5.2
>> [...]
>> So there we go:
>> 1) open SqueakMap Catalog from Apps menu
>> 2) no packages there (Trunk image), have to right-click the package list and disable "New safely-available packages"
>> 3) enter "refactoring" in the Search package box, hit return. Takes me to AwesomAtom first. Hmm. Unfortunately Refactoring Tools starts with an R, so I won't get there with repeated return hitting any time soon
>> 3½) since I happen to already know the name, scroll down to Refactoring Tools manually
>> 4) right-click, Install. "The package has no published release for your Squeak version [...]". Yes. Another warning prompt, yes.
>
>
> Problems for a newcomer:
> 1) What is SqueakMap? Or how would I even know I need to look at it, it is not mentioned in the Welcome to Squeak text.
> 2&4) Newcomers should definitely stick to release images :-) and hope that the packages have versions for the latest one.
> 3) The search mode seems unintuitive (although I guess I understand why it does what it does)
>
> I hope that the experience is improved and simplified with the changes Chris has coming.
>
> I used to install Metacello via SqueakMap before the item in the Do menu appeared, so my annoyances were 2), 3), 4). Looking up the install snippet on GitHub is not faster. Typing Installer ensureRecentMetacello is faster, but then I have to remember that. I didn't know about the "Extending the system" page until two days ago.
>
> Still I'd rather like to keep the Metacello item in the Do menu. Or Apps or Tools. Doesn't matter to me whether it is at the top, in the middle or at the bottom. After clicking that, I can continue to copy the install script from the GitHub project's README that I had right in front of me when I decided that I need to grab a new trunk image.
>
> The community might decide to drop the Git infrastructure item (remember Chris: I did not put it there, the fans of it did), but I think easing the access to GitHub projects is important in the present and the future.
>
> Kind regards,
> Jakob
>