https://www.dropbox.com/s/09rbm70rj86cqr1/ComSwiki4.5.zip?dl=0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/09rbm70rj86cqr1/ComSwiki4.5.zip?dl=0
I put the ComSwiki in a 4.5 All-In-One with the swiki directory of files. If you double click, it’ll open up the image. From there a person can press start on the ComSwikiLauncher and go to localhost:8888 to see it running. I was reading “Squeak: Open Personal Computing And Multimedia” recently and Dan Ingalls said some people downloaded the ComSwiki not for Squeak but to have a wiki (“Back To The Future Once More”). Sounded like it was an app to draw people to the language.
I intend to add a link on the homepage under FunSqueak to ComSwiki4.5. It can be downloaded above. If it doesn’t work or people don’t think I should make this publicly available from the homepage, please let me know.
Chris
On 10/27/14, 1:00 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/09rbm70rj86cqr1/ComSwiki4.5.zip?dl=0
I put the ComSwiki in a 4.5 All-In-One with the swiki directory of files. If you double click, it¹ll open up the image. From there a person can press start on the ComSwikiLauncher and go to localhost:8888 to see it running. I was reading ³Squeak: Open Personal Computing And Multimedia² recently and Dan Ingalls said some people downloaded the ComSwiki not for Squeak but to have a wiki (³Back To The Future Once More²). Sounded like it was an app to draw people to the language.
I intend to add a link on the homepage under FunSqueak to ComSwiki4.5. It can be downloaded above. If it doesn¹t work or people don¹t think I should make this publicly available from the homepage, please let me know.
Chris
The ani folder is not deployds, but you can see itj in the swiki browser.
Edgar
On Oct 27, 2014, at 2:57 PM, Edgar J. De Cleene edgardec2005@gmail.com wrote:
On 10/27/14, 1:00 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/09rbm70rj86cqr1/ComSwiki4.5.zip?dl=0
I put the ComSwiki in a 4.5 All-In-One with the swiki directory of files. If you double click, it’ll open up the image. From there a person can press start on the ComSwikiLauncher and go to localhost:8888 to see it running. I was reading “Squeak: Open Personal Computing And Multimedia” recently and Dan Ingalls said some people downloaded the ComSwiki not for Squeak but to have a wiki (“Back To The Future Once More”). Sounded like it was an app to draw people to the language.
I intend to add a link on the homepage under FunSqueak to ComSwiki4.5. It can be downloaded above. If it doesn’t work or people don’t think I should make this publicly available from the homepage, please let me know.
Chris
The ani folder is not deployds, but you can see itj in the swiki browser.
Edgar
OK, you opened the SwikiBrowser, perhaps with this:
(SwikiBrowser asMorphOnShelf: SwikiShelf allInstances first) openInWorld
and the “ani” is present. Hmm, that’s true. I see it as well. The SwikiBrowser shows all the files in the “swiki” folder regardless of whether they are used or not. It just shows files. I guess if the ani is not showing up then it’s a configuration thing. Not essential, I don’t suppose, though. The “ani” is a different version of the same kind of wiki seen in “refs”. Thanks for pointing it out. I’ll have to figure out how to switch between the two or have both at the same time.
Chris
On 10/27/14, 4:20 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
OK, you opened the SwikiBrowser, perhaps with this:
(SwikiBrowser asMorphOnShelf: SwikiShelf allInstances first) openInWorld
and the ³ani² is present. Hmm, that¹s true. I see it as well. The SwikiBrowser shows all the files in the ³swiki² folder regardless of whether they are used or not. It just shows files. I guess if the ani is not showing up then it¹s a configuration thing. Not essential, I don¹t suppose, though. The ³ani² is a different version of the same kind of wiki seen in ³refs². Thanks for pointing it out. I¹ll have to figure out how to switch between the two or have both at the same time.
Chris
The point in cuestion is ani is the last and cute version of Swiki. If you don¹t have it, can¹t inherit of this
See http://190.189.179.48:8888/ is served by very old SqueakLight.
If you plan resurrect and develop ComSwiki, I can help with how to have tons of js, css, etc like tinymce, bootstrap, others free cute doing visual impact to user.
http://190.189.179.48:9090/ user: visita pass: (nothing here)
It¹s old Sblog and old Swiki served on tp of HV2
Edgar
On Oct 27, 2014, at 4:26 PM, Edgar J. De Cleene edgardec2005@gmail.com wrote:
On 10/27/14, 4:20 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
OK, you opened the SwikiBrowser, perhaps with this:
(SwikiBrowser asMorphOnShelf: SwikiShelf allInstances first) openInWorld
and the “ani” is present. Hmm, that’s true. I see it as well. The SwikiBrowser shows all the files in the “swiki” folder regardless of whether they are used or not. It just shows files. I guess if the ani is not showing up then it’s a configuration thing. Not essential, I don’t suppose, though. The “ani” is a different version of the same kind of wiki seen in “refs”. Thanks for pointing it out. I’ll have to figure out how to switch between the two or have both at the same time.
Chris
The point in cuestion is ani is the last and cute version of Swiki. If you don’t have it, can’t inherit of this
See http://190.189.179.48:8888/ http://190.189.179.48:8888/ is served by very old SqueakLight.
If you plan resurrect and develop ComSwiki, I can help with how to have tons of js, css, etc like tinymce, bootstrap, others free cute doing visual impact to user.
http://190.189.179.48:9090/ http://190.189.179.48:9090/ user: visita pass: (nothing here)
It’s old Sblog and old Swiki served on tp of HV2
Edgar
Wow. This stuff looks great. I’m glad someone has lots of knowledge of how to use the Swiki. I’m not going to pretend I do. There’s quite a lot to it. And, yes, your help would be great. I’m impressed you have Bootstrap on a Swiki. Time to start editing and adding to the Swiki Swiki, I guess.
Chris
On 10/27/14, 5:55 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
Edgar
Wow. This stuff looks great. I¹m glad someone has lots of knowledge of how to use the Swiki. I¹m not going to pretend I do. There¹s quite a lot to it. And, yes, your help would be great. I¹m impressed you have Bootstrap on a Swiki. Time to start editing and adding to the Swiki Swiki, I guess.
Chris
Ok, I check for start with a Bootstrap bar on top your All in One. Send to youfor review, enhance, etc when ready.
Edgar
On 10/27/14, 5:55 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
Edgar
Wow. This stuff looks great. I¹m glad someone has lots of knowledge of how to use the Swiki. I¹m not going to pretend I do. There¹s quite a lot to it. And, yes, your help would be great. I¹m impressed you have Bootstrap on a Swiki. Time to start editing and adding to the Swiki Swiki, I guess.
Chris
Ok, I check for start with a Bootstrap bar on top your All in One. Send to youfor review, enhance, etc when ready.
Edgar
I think maybe is time to move to newer and cute web frameworks. Consider look http://190.189.179.48:7070/browse, courtesy of last of our cousins of Pharo.
Maybe have more sense build on top of this ?
ComSwiki was the state of art back in 2006, but not now
Edgar
On Tue, Oct 28, 2014 at 7:14 AM, Edgar J. De Cleene edgardec2005@gmail.com wrote:
On 10/27/14, 5:55 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
Edgar
Wow. This stuff looks great. I¹m glad someone has lots of knowledge of
how to
use the Swiki. I¹m not going to pretend I do. There¹s quite a lot to it. And, yes, your help would be great. I¹m impressed you have Bootstrap on a Swiki. Time to start editing and adding to the Swiki Swiki, I guess.
Chris
Ok, I check for start with a Bootstrap bar on top your All in One. Send to youfor review, enhance, etc when ready.
Edgar
I think maybe is time to move to newer and cute web frameworks. Consider look http://190.189.179.48:7070/browse, courtesy of last of our cousins of Pharo.
Maybe have more sense build on top of this ?
ComSwiki was the state of art back in 2006, but not now
True, but I still have a swiki running at work from back in '98. It was
upgraded to squeak 3.7 at some point, but it just keeps on working. New is fun, and often very useful. But solid is really nice - especially when you don't want to worry about it.
-cbc
On 10/28/14, 11:28 AM, "Chris Cunningham" cunningham.cb@gmail.com wrote:
True, but I still have a swiki running at work from back in '98. It was upgraded to squeak 3.7 at some point, but it just keeps on working. New is fun, and often very useful. But solid is really nice - especially when you don't want to worry about it.
-cbc
Ok, but you can migrate as me.
It¹s from 2010. .image is my fork of Cuis Visually looks like real swiki, but all is HV2.
And if not sell to you, always test what you do.
Edgar
On Oct 28, 2014, at 10:14 AM, Edgar J. De Cleene edgardec2005@gmail.com wrote:
On 10/27/14, 5:55 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
Edgar
Wow. This stuff looks great. I¹m glad someone has lots of knowledge of how to use the Swiki. I¹m not going to pretend I do. There¹s quite a lot to it. And, yes, your help would be great. I¹m impressed you have Bootstrap on a Swiki. Time to start editing and adding to the Swiki Swiki, I guess.
Chris
Ok, I check for start with a Bootstrap bar on top your All in One. Send to youfor review, enhance, etc when ready.
Edgar
I think maybe is time to move to newer and cute web frameworks. Consider look http://190.189.179.48:7070/browse, courtesy of last of our cousins of Pharo.
Maybe have more sense build on top of this ?
No.
ComSwiki was the state of art back in 2006, but not now
More like 2002. I refer you to “Squeak- Multimedia and Personal Computing” (And if people want to read about Flow sockets and streams which power Spoon/Context, they can do so on pp. 170-173).
Edgar
What are we trying to accomplish here? Why revisit the ComSwiki? Because it is the institutional memory of the Squeak community online. It is over ten years of articles. Over 6000. We want to preserve that. We want to build on that.
In some ways, what I’m about to say is similar to the recent discussion about ImageSegments.
There are two things to consider here: the data; and, the application.
Ultimately we don’t care about ComSwiki or XML files. We do care about the institutional memory of the community. That’s the priority.
Let’s look at data. These articles are in XML files. People here sneer at XML. Good for them. But notice that these files have lasted a decade. That’s incredible. Show me any data gathered by Pier or SmallWiki or TinyWiki that has lasted a decade. Nowhere to be found.
Before Lukas was Mr. Seaside, he was Mr. Wiki. He didn’t like XML. At all. He stored everything in some binary blob. If I give you a random binary blob from ten years ago, how well is it going to explain itself? If I give you an image segment from a decade ago, you wouldn’t know where to start. XML explains itself. Very clearly. Mark Guzdial made an informed decision to keep documents independent of applications. In the Relax NG book from O’Reilly that arrived yesterday on my doorstep (“Relax NG”, 2004) it says exactly that on pg. 3.
That is a powerful principal of the Swiki design. It has served us well. Lukas can come back from Google right now and say it’s not useful. Avi could show up and talk about Image Segments and DabbleDB and I don’t think they could refute how useful this principal is. You could probably say the same thing about Fuel. It’s the reason SQL is popular.
We are making the ComSwiki backward compatible. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. The Swiki is remarkably well designed and remarkably reliable and has a clear separation between application and data.
The ComSwiki can be superseded but there in no need to do that anything faster than a snail’s pace because it just works.
Chris
On 10/28/14, 12:11 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
What are we trying to accomplish here? Why revisit the ComSwiki? Because it is the institutional memory of the Squeak community online. It is over ten years of articles. Over 6000. We want to preserve that. We want to build on that.
In some ways, what I¹m about to say is similar to the recent discussion about ImageSegments.
There are two things to consider here: the data; and, the application.
Ultimately we don¹t care about ComSwiki or XML files. We do care about the institutional memory of the community. That¹s the priority.
Let¹s look at data. These articles are in XML files. People here sneer at XML. Good for them. But notice that these files have lasted a decade. That¹s incredible. Show me any data gathered by Pier or SmallWiki or TinyWiki that has lasted a decade. Nowhere to be found.
Before Lukas was Mr. Seaside, he was Mr. Wiki. He didn¹t like XML. At all. He stored everything in some binary blob. If I give you a random binary blob from ten years ago, how well is it going to explain itself? If I give you an image segment from a decade ago, you wouldn¹t know where to start. XML explains itself. Very clearly. Mark Guzdial made an informed decision to keep documents independent of applications. In the Relax NG book from O¹Reilly that arrived yesterday on my doorstep (³Relax NG², 2004) it says exactly that on pg. 3.
That is a powerful principal of the Swiki design. It has served us well. Lukas can come back from Google right now and say it¹s not useful. Avi could show up and talk about Image Segments and DabbleDB and I don¹t think they could refute how useful this principal is. You could probably say the same thing about Fuel. It¹s the reason SQL is popular.
We are making the ComSwiki backward compatible. If it ain¹t broke don¹t fix it. The Swiki is remarkably well designed and remarkably reliable and has a clear separation between application and data.
The ComSwiki can be superseded but there in no need to do that anything faster than a snail¹s pace because it just works.
Chris
+1
Chris
What you wrote about the XML files and the long term preservation of institutional memory is very well observed and summarized.
Thank you for bringing up this issue.
Actually I wonder why this idea of packing the Swiki XML files together with the Wiki software into an All-In-One package did not come up earlier.....
--Hannes
On 10/28/14, Edgar J. De Cleene edgardec2005@gmail.com wrote:
On 10/28/14, 12:11 PM, "Chris Cunnington" brasspen@gmail.com wrote:
What are we trying to accomplish here? Why revisit the ComSwiki? Because it is the institutional memory of the Squeak community online. It is over ten years of articles. Over 6000. We want to preserve that. We want to build on that.
In some ways, what I¹m about to say is similar to the recent discussion about ImageSegments.
There are two things to consider here: the data; and, the application.
Ultimately we don¹t care about ComSwiki or XML files. We do care about the institutional memory of the community. That¹s the priority.
Let¹s look at data. These articles are in XML files. People here sneer at XML. Good for them. But notice that these files have lasted a decade. That¹s incredible. Show me any data gathered by Pier or SmallWiki or TinyWiki that has lasted a decade. Nowhere to be found.
Before Lukas was Mr. Seaside, he was Mr. Wiki. He didn¹t like XML. At all. He stored everything in some binary blob. If I give you a random binary blob from ten years ago, how well is it going to explain itself? If I give you an image segment from a decade ago, you wouldn¹t know where to start. XML explains itself. Very clearly. Mark Guzdial made an informed decision to keep documents independent of applications. In the Relax NG book from O¹Reilly that arrived yesterday on my doorstep (³Relax NG², 2004) it says exactly that on pg. 3.
That is a powerful principal of the Swiki design. It has served us well. Lukas can come back from Google right now and say it¹s not useful. Avi could show up and talk about Image Segments and DabbleDB and I don¹t think they could refute how useful this principal is. You could probably say the same thing about Fuel. It¹s the reason SQL is popular.
We are making the ComSwiki backward compatible. If it ain¹t broke don¹t fix it. The Swiki is remarkably well designed and remarkably reliable and has a clear separation between application and data.
The ComSwiki can be superseded but there in no need to do that anything faster than a snail¹s pace because it just works.
Chris
+1
squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org
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Chris Cunningham -
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Edgar J. De Cleene -
H. Hirzel