Hi Dan!

Feel free to ask more - below follows a "get into the water" recipe for
building web apps (which I presume you want to do).

Dan Ingalls <Dan at SqueakLand.org> wrote:
> Folks -
> 
> I've never run a server in Squeak (or anything else for that matter 
> (of course)).  I thought it would be easiest to start with a Swiki, 
> get it going, understand it, and then subvert it to the real purpose 
> I have in mind.

Some words about the "real purpose" would make it a bit easier to give
advice. :)
 
> Can someone please...
> 
> 1.  Point me at good documentation.

Ehrm, are we talking about a web app? Or some custom socket stuff? Or a
wiki implementation?
Swiki itself (the original implementation) is a bit cryptic and if you
aren't specifically interested in building a wiki-wiki, then I would not
start looking there.

If you want to start doing simple web stuff and get going quickly
without needing to understand the Magic of Seaside then I think
HttpView2 is very simple to get started and play with. It has a few
small examples and "Hello world" as a web app is a *single method* in *a
single class* started as a server with *a single line*.

> 2.  Suggest which Squeak release would the best combination of being 
> relatively up to date, and yet having the least bit rot (if there is 
> any) in the server code.

We who build web apps typically use 3.8 (or even 3.7) today. Note: If
you use 3.7/3.8 you could also install FastSocketStream (a new
implementation of class SocketStream) from SM and change the references
to use it instead of the standard SocketStream class. In 3.9 that
implementation of class SocketStream is default.

> 3.  (If it isn't obvious from (1)) Hum a few bars about how you can 
> run the server on the same machine as you use it from, either in the 
> same Squeak, or in two separate copies.

I always run it in the same image as you develop in, no problem. The
best way to *get started really quickly* if you want to grok the basics
is IMHO to:

1. Get Squeak 3.8, install these using the SqueakMap Package Loader
under the open... menu:
	- DynamicBindings   (this is a "thread locals" implementation by
Stephen Pair, it is used in KomHttpServer but is generally useful)
	- KomServices		(a services framework, mainly Tcp, but also other stuff,
is used by other packages too)
	- KomHttpServer		(the web server itself, has competition these days and
will eventually probably be merged with Swazoo but time, time...)
	- HTMLBuilder		(a HTML generation library derived from Seaside and
HttpView. Seaside has now a newer model so it is only used in HttpView2
AFAIK)
	- HttpView2			(a very small simple web "framework" which simply maps
URL directories into methods in a neat way, used by SqueakMap for
example)

	...and if you want to use the "newest" SocketStream now used in 3.9,
install FastSocketStream and change the reference in class HttpAdaptor
to use it.

2. Look in category HV-examples, read the class comments and methods.
Use the debugger - put a self halt in there, use your Firefox, and
examine the call stack inside the debugger all the way up to the Socket
communication.

Then, if HV2 doesn't fit your bill - it is best in simple apps or apps
where you want total control over URLs and state management (since it is
so much hands on and hackable) - Seaside is the way to go for more
advanced apps, but it adds quite a bit of magic so it is not as easy to
see how things work IMHO. But for advanced web apps Seaside blows HV2
out of the water. It also builds HTML using Smalltalk etc but uses
continuations etc to maintain all state on the server side - so you
don't need to muck about with URL parameters and all the other tricks to
keep track of your state. It also uses a better HTML rendering model
these days (the WACanvas classes).

> Thanks much in advance
> 
> 	- Dan

regards, Göran