[Seaside] Sending e-mails

Wed May 5 17:49:02 UTC 2010

I jumped through many of the same hoops in my last job. There are all kinds
of ways you can end up blocked if you're not careful (if you can, make sure
the host--read IP--you are using for your outgoing SMTP server is not
originating *any* other IP traffic).

I'm surprised you would be blocked for passing through relayed SMTP servers,
though. That is very common and a pretty core part of the SMTP system (even
gmail relays mail through several SMTP servers). I guess if you were
relaying through an IP in a dynamic address database, that could get your
spam score bumped up. But you're going to have a hard time getting around
that these days.

Although I wonder: can you not configure sendmail on your local machine to
forward the mail on without adding itself in a Received header? Then it
should appear to your ISP's server just like you are sending it with any
other SMTP client directly (hmm... you might have to omit the message ID as
well?). I'd be curious if that made any difference.

Julian

On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 5:06 PM, Nevin Pratt <nevin at bountifulbaby.com> wrote:

>  Julian
>
> We used to do that with our Bountiful Baby email.  It works fine.  However,
> it was still flagged as spam for some of our customers, because their email
> systems noticed that we relayed from a mail server (our local sendmail) on
> through yet another mail server (the ISP's), and the emails were flagged as
> suspicious because of that.
>
> Before doing the above, we used to rely solely on our own SMTP server and
> not relay through the ISP, but then some of the email was flagged as spam I
> *think* because our SMTP server wasn't a well-known server at the time
> (which is why we started relaying through the ISP's server).
>
> We've never found a completely "fool-proof" solution.  Some percentage of
> the outgoing emails is always going to be flagged as spam, no matter what.
> The trick is to pick the solution that results in the least spam flags.  And
> it's not easy.
>
> I've now gone back to just using our own SMTP server, rather than relaying
> through the ISP, for emails that are sent directly from our website, and
> relaying through the ISP for all the rest.  Now that Bountiful Baby isn't a
> completely unknown company, I'm thinking that's going to work out to be the
> best now.  But I'm not sure, and it's still being tested.  And, things seem
> to always change out from under us, so what works best today might not work
> best tomorrow.
>
> But otherwise I think I would agree with you, and do it the way you
> suggest.  At least as a starting point.
>
> Nevin
>
>
> Configure sendmail to listen only on localhost and forward mail to your
> ISP's SMTP server. This is likely what I would use in a deployed
> environment.
>
> Julian
>
> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 7:53 AM, AxiNat <tibabenfortlapalanca at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Okay, this is what I found so far (example in SMTPClient):
>>
>> self deliverMailFrom: 'm.rueger at acm.org' to: #('m.rueger at acm.org') text:
>> 'Subject: this is a test
>>
>> Hello from Pharo!
>> '    usingServer: 'smtp.concentric.net'
>>
>> I tried that using my own smtp server, but it requires authentication and
>> doesn't let the e-mail go through. If I try it with a local sendmail daemon,
>> my guess is that the message is gonna end up in the spam folder of most
>> people... I remember at university we had this exercises consisting on
>> sending e-mails through sendmail and straight via telnet, and they would end
>> up classified as spam, I'm not sure whether this is the same case tho...
>>
>> Does someone have further information on that patch that allows
>> authentication?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>>
>> 2010/5/5 Lukas Renggli <renggli at gmail.com>
>>
>>> Not necessarily, you can connect to any SMTP server. I am not sure if
>>> authentication is built in nowadays, but there was a patch floating
>>> around that would add it.
>>>
>>> Lukas
>>>
>>> On 5 May 2010 08:19, AxiNat <tibabenfortlapalanca at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > I'm on Pharo 1.0, been checking SMTPClient, but it still looks like it
>>> needs
>>> > sendmail to be running in the system, or I may totally be
>>> missunderstanding
>>> > the way it works, which is a very plausible option possibility...
>>> >
>>> > 2010/5/5 Lukas Renggli <renggli at gmail.com>
>>> >>
>>> >> Seaside does not provide an SMTP library, but most Smalltalk dialects
>>> >> do. On which Smalltalk are you?
>>> >>
>>> >> Lukas
>>> >>
>>> >> On 5 May 2010 07:21, AxiNat <tibabenfortlapalanca at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> > Hi all,
>>> >> >
>>> >> > I'd like to know what's the best way to send e-mails from a seaside
>>> app,
>>> >> > so
>>> >> > far I've read about some Smalltalk SMTP library, using unix sendmail
>>> or
>>> >> > sendEmail.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > sendEmail sounds like the easiest method, but I don't like depending
>>> on
>>> >> > external tools...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Any suggestions, tips? Any howtos around?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Thanks!
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Bernat Romagosa.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > _______________________________________________
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>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> --
>>> >> Lukas Renggli
>>> >> www.lukas-renggli.ch
>>> >> _______________________________________________
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>>> >
>>> >
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>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Lukas Renggli
>>> www.lukas-renggli.ch
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> seaside mailing list
>>> seaside at lists.squeakfoundation.org
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>>
>>
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