On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:24:20 -0400, Lex Spoon <lex at cc.gatech.edu> wrote:

> First, the package universes work I have put time into, is the *only*
> working solution we have to a real problem: generating stable sets of
> packages.  I spent extensive time trying to convince powers that be to
> modify our infrastructure to use this approach.  When that failed, I
> coded it up myself and have offered the service using my own resources.
> Despite this effort, the response has consistently been that universes
> is attacking someone's turf.  On the mailing list, I get posts along the
> lines of "how can you do this" and "how can you cause this
> fragmentation".  On the Swiki it is worse.  For days, every time I
> posted a mention of universes, someone in the .ch domain edited the page
> to put a defamotory comment beside it.  One of the defamations went so
> far as to dismiss the project by saying "universes has not been adopted
> by SqueakMap".  This is a telling statement -- someone out there in .ch,
> sincerely believes that SqueakMap approval is *already* the measure of
> legitimacy in Squeak.

Hey, your universes rock. I said that when you did it (as did someone else  
who, like me, was actually using it) and its what I use. The idea that it  
causes fragmentation is nonsense. It's a simple and highly effective  
usability tool.

But can't the new system work to resolve problems like this? You say  
"someone out there"; currently, the buck doesn't stop anywhere. If people  
respect the new hierarchy, there's a place for the buck to stop. The  
discussions don't stop because there are people assuming control; they get  
focus.

It seems like you've had bad experiences with this kind of arrangement,  
but that's more about the people than the system. Yes?