Squeak-dev October 2006

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175 participants
305 discussions

RE: Removing Etoys (was Re: A process proposal for 3.10)
by jvuletich＠dc.uba.ar 26 Oct '06

26 Oct '06

Hi Ron. You seem to believe there are people around who are wishing to implement stuff just because others want it, not because of their own interest. Well, I'm pretty sure there's none. So, if the very people who are contributing specific ideas is not willing to work on them, who will? If we don't find an answer to this question, me must accept answers like "you do it and it's done". Cheers, Juan Vuletich > I agree with you and have been thinking about the implications of scratch > your own itch programming. I firmly believe that this community would > benefit from listing to users and integrating user feedback into the > process. We need to find a way to work together to meet the common goal > of > relevance for each participating group. There is a lot going on in the > community and I believe we would benefit from integrating the many itches > that are currently being scratched. Past that we should be looking for > ways > to better organize and incorporate user feedback into development teams. > (I > learned this valuable lesson in the business world: There is nothing worse > then spending valuable resources developing terrific features that nobody > really wants or needs). > > I also believe that there are a number of programmers willing to > participate > but are not able to lead these efforts mostly because of time constraints > (not ability). We need a way to incorporate private company's > contributions, research projects, volunteer efforts, and user's needs into > a > cohesive process that advances Squeak towards relevance. I'm not sure how > we are going to get there, but it will be a very good place when we do. > > Ron Teitelbaum > President / Principal Software Engineer > US Medical Record Specialists > Ron(a)USMedRec.com > >> From: Stéphane Rollandin >> Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 9:10 AM >> >> too often on this list we see questions or reports like "this feature is >> broken could it be fixed ?" or "that feature would be nice to have" that >> are only answered by a blunt (and in my view quite rude) "then are you >> ready to work on it ?". >> >> I am tired of this trick. a more correct answer would be in the line of >> "nobody seems to be engaged in doing this, sorry". >> >> I don't see the need to pressure people, especially publicly, and >> especially people who participate in the debate about the future of >> Squeak. >> >> these people should better be thanked for their interest. they are >> contributing ideas and opinions, ok it's not code, but it's not >> valueless either. >> >> >> regards, >> >> Stef > > > > >

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License conversion questions
by Pavel Krivanek 26 Oct '06

26 Oct '06

Hi, we've got this two lists http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/2006-October/109905.… http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/pipermail/squeak-dev/2006-October/110424.… and other sources like http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/8 1) Is there published some current list with initials, author names and the status agreement with license conversion? 2) Where can authors place agreement with license change of their code? 3) What will we do with methods without author initials? 4) What kind of change is the minimal condition for ownership transfer of a method? 5) Can new method owner change license of the method? It's surely derived work and SqueakL tells: "You may distribute and sublicense such Modified Software only under the terms of a valid, binding license that makes no representations or warranties on behalf of Apple, and is no less protective of Apple and Apple's rights than this License." -- Pavel

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[Job] for a squeaker
by Marcus Denker 26 Oct '06

26 Oct '06

> Cadence Design Systems, the leader in Electronic Design Automation, > is seeking outstanding software engineers for a novel technology > project at its San Jose, California campus. > > We are seeking developers with the following qualifications: > Object Oriented design and modeling > Advanced degree in Computer Science > Working experience with Smalltalk/Squeak desirable > Exposure to formal methods > Exposure to system design languages (UML, Mathlab/Simulink, System- > C, Esterel), and system design flows an advantage > Ability to work in a fast paced industrial environment > Current US work permit > > > Interested parties should contact Gilad Bracha (Gilad(a)Cadence.com). >

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Reminder:Smalltalk Meeting Sat, 28th October
by Marcus Denker 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

Hello, We organize a Smalltalk event in Bern the Saturday 28th October 2006. [Newbies] are especially encouraged! Meet other Squeakers, the chance to learn and have fun. Where? Software Composition Group Schützenmattstrasse 14 3012 Bern /Switzerland http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~scg/Resources/Maps/index.html When? Saturday, 28h of October 2006, starting from 9:30am, open ended More information: http://smallwiki.unibe.ch/ssug/ smalltalkpartythe28thofoctober2006/ If there are questions, don't hesitate to contact me. Marcus

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[ANN] SSpec v0.13 ported to Squeak
by Keith Hodges 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

I have just ported SSpec v0.13 to Squeak. get it here: http://www.squeaksource.com/SSpec For instructions as to how to use it, see page 2 of this brief explanation. http://typo.daveastels.com/files/sSpec_QuickRef.pdf and the first edition of the manual is http://typo.daveastels.com/files/sspec_manual.pdf enjoy Keith p.s. only the TextTestRunner ported so far Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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Minnow WIKI Status
by Ron Teitelbaum 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

All, The cryptography team is going to do some documentation on wiki. Can anyone please tell me the status of Minnow? Are we going to move the wiki to somewhere else? Will minnow content be moved; is it safe to use it now? Thanks, Ron Teitelbaum Squeak Cryptography Team Leader

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Capabilities in Squeak (attn: Lex Spoon and friends)
by Michael van der Gulik 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

Hi all. Does anybody have code (particularly VM modifications) which allow Capabilities in Squeak? In particular, I'm referring to code that implements stuff described on this page: http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/uploads/2074/sandbox.html In the past there have been a couple of ambitious projects that allow security in Squeak such as Squeak-E. What became of these? Is there code floating around somewhere? I'm only seeing Squeak-ELib on squeakmap. I'm particularly interested in a debugger which uses Capabilities to debug/inspect objects rather than invoke methods such as Object>>printOn:. I'm working with message capture stuff, and the debugger falls over badly. Michael.

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Smalltalk Reloaded Was:Re: Removing Etoys (was Re: A process proposal for 3.10)
by Laurence Rozier 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

All, E-toys has a long history memorialized in places like Google and as has been mentioned elsewhere e-toys will continue to have an association with Squeak because of OLPC. People will be introduced to Squeak in part because of e-toys. All other considerations aside, if e-toys is unloaded from the main distribution and cannot be easily reloaded by a new Squeaker, there will be confusion and for many disappointment and/or some other non-positive experience. I changed the subject to "Smalltalk Reloaded" because like Neo in The Matrix, many of us have been down this path before. There's a larger, older problem looming which the Smalltalk community has not fared well with in the past. Ron has touched on some issues about how we function together in this community. For me, they speak to Smalltalk being "for the creative spirit in everyone" which is what I originally bought into 25 years ago. Dave Thomas put it well: Smalltalk is much more than a programming language, it is a complete environment that represents the true philosophy of open, user-driven computing. Smalltalk provides an environment that makes programming fun for young and old, and it shields us from the plethora of APIs and technology our industry calls progress. It respects the disparate cultures of business programmers, students and systems programmers. Most of all it encourages "we" programming as opposed to "me" programming. Travels With Smalltalk<http://www.mojowire.com/TravelsWithSmalltalk/DaveThomas-TravelsWithSmalltal…> In the early 90's, before Java Smalltalk had a thriving prosperous community. IBM, ParcPlace and Digitalk offerings were gaining momentum in large corporations where C++ was failing miserably in enterprise projects. Many(most?) new major projects were choosing Smalltalk(Object-Oriented Information Systems by David Taylor documents this). Small and independent developers could learn from the affordable Smalltalk/V family and with the advent of Widgets/WindowBuilder could deploy solutions with it. Books were being written. If you were a knowledgeable Smalltalker, you could make a good living doing it. Then lots of smart people couldn't figure out a reasonable, mutually beneficial way forward. It really doesn't matter who you think was "more" to blame, the vacuum that was filled by Java wasn't created by anti-Smalltalkers, it came from the implosions within the community. There are interesting parallels to where Smalltalk is today, but the difference is that given a little bit more time, Croquet, Spoon and the Strongtalk VM will provide a powerful flexible, mutually beneficial way forward. In the interim, we need IMO to avoid the kinds of implosions we've seen in the past. Making an etoyless main Squeak distribution that can't reload e-toys is an implosion. If you're feeling impatient, consider that some of us have been at it for several decades and are still here to encourage you - you and Smalltalk can survive a wait. Seeking a respectful and fun way forward for everyone, Laurence On 10/24/06, goran(a)krampe.se <goran(a)krampe.se> wrote: > > > Markus Gaelli <gaelli(a)emergent.de> wrote: > > Count me in. > > Markus > > Ok! So I counted 4-5 people. Two questions: > > 1. Would it be a real problem if you were instead forced to use the > Squeakland image etc? Not for knowledgeable Squeakers who follow the list and are aware of the different distros(I wonder what that count is). However, given 2. Are you committed in the extent that you would actually join an eToys > team making it loadable? Juan has already shown that it can be ripped > out - next step would be making it loadable I presume. It seems to me that the folks proposing to remove something with so much history and current usage. Why not have a an eToy-less image that regards, Göran > >

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SqueakSource: RESTful URLs?
by Andreas Raab 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

Hi Guys - I've been looking to link up source code directly to web pages and was wondering how hard it would be to support RESTful Urls on SqueakSource. What I'm thinking about is something like an interface that allows us to browse particular classes, for example: http://www.squeaksource.com/browse/ss/SqueakSource-pmm.1002/SSAccessPolicy/… There might be other ways to formulate the request in nicer ways but you get the idea, namely that we can link to particular classes and methods in a well-defined way instead of having to explain "go to http://squeaksource.com/ss.html then click on <versions>, then find SqueakSource-pmm.1002, then click on <browse code>, then click on SSAccessPolicy, and then click on the admins method". Since I have never touched the SS code base I have no idea how hard it would be to implement such a feature. So perhaps anyone else is interested in adding an improvement like that? Cheers, - Andreas

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Problem with Midi on Linux
by Martin Drautzburg 25 Oct '06

25 Oct '06

Squeak 3.8 #6665, Debian etch/sid, alsa I can't seem to get Midi to work. I tried: MidiPrimTester new getDriverParameters MidiPrimTester new getPortList but both give me 'a primitive has failed' And SimpleMIDIPort primPortCount returns 0 Midi is basically working on my box martin@beaureve:~$ aplaymidi -l Port Client name Port name 24:0 ESS ES1938 (Solo-1) MIDI ESS ES1938 (Solo-1) MIDI 25:0 OPL3 FM synth OPL3 FM Port It is a stock vm from squeak.org. I am not sure if I need an extra shared library, but I doubt it as "strings squeak | grep -i midi" gives me sqMIDIOpenPort sqMIDIParameterGet sqMIDIPortWriteFromAt sqMIDIPortReadInto sqMIDIGetPortName serialPortMidiClockRate sqMIDIGetClock midiShutdown MIDIPlugin_exports sqMIDIClosePort sqMIDIGetPortDirectionality midiInit sqMIDIParameterSet sqMIDIParameter sqMIDIGetPortCount MIDIPlugin primitiveMIDIClosePort primitiveMIDIGetClock primitiveMIDIGetPortCount primitiveMIDIGetPortName primitiveMIDIOpenPort primitiveMIDIRead primitiveMIDIWrite primitiveMIDIGetPortDirectionality primitiveMIDIParameterGetOrSet MIDIPlugin 19 March 2005 (i) primitiveMIDIParameterSet primitiveMIDIParameterGet Am I missing something obvious ?

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