On 10/13/06, Andreas Raab andreas.raab@gmx.de wrote:
Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
Andreas, as you see no package said " OpenGL" in the provided link.
I think you should learn a little about using Squeaksource: "Versions"
Ouch! I missed the package too, because in www.squeaksource.com usually there is one MC package per "Project".
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)>
Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
And another question... As I wrote in the previous mail I've started to do some SDL bindings. But I think that maybe it's a waste of time, since today nearly all machines have OpenGL, and Squeak already has objects to deal with sound and joysticks.... so instead of using SDL for 2D graphics is better to use OpenGL for the same thing, what do yo thing about that?
Cheers, Diego
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)>
Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
And another question... As I wrote in the previous mail I've started to do some SDL bindings. But I think that maybe it's a waste of time, since today nearly all machines have OpenGL, and Squeak already has objects to deal with sound and joysticks.... so instead of using SDL for 2D graphics is better to use OpenGL for the same thing, what do yo thing about that?
Don't know. Depends on what you're doing and where you are going. SDL might be just fine for what you need to do. That said, OpenGL offers a lot of value in the long term.
Cheers, - Andreas
To explore OpenGL, be advised:
"Be sure that your graphics card is OpenGL 1.3 or higher compliant AND that you have appropriate OpenGL hardware drivers installed. Windows users should be aware that upgrading your DirectX versions through Microsoft's web site often overwrites existing hardware OpenGL drivers with software OpenGL->DirectX wrappers (killing performance, if not compatibility). The fix is to re-install the video card manufacturer's drivers after any DirectX install procedure."
The above is from the Croquet downloads page. There has been discussion of driver issues on the Croquet mailing lists and wikis...
On Oct 13, 2006, at 5:55 PM, Andreas Raab wrote:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
And another question... As I wrote in the previous mail I've started to do some SDL bindings. But I think that maybe it's a waste of time, since today nearly all machines have OpenGL, and Squeak already has objects to deal with sound and joysticks.... so instead of using SDL for 2D graphics is better to use OpenGL for the same thing, what do yo thing about that?
Don't know. Depends on what you're doing and where you are going. SDL might be just fine for what you need to do. That said, OpenGL offers a lot of value in the long term.
Cheers,
- Andreas
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you write a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL Api from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you write a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL Api from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you write a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL Api from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you write a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Ok, that is great! Micke
On 11/6/06, Diego Fernandez diegof79@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL Api from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long ulong)> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created with a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you write a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Hello,
I took old PositionalArgs, did minimal changes and installed it into 3.9 image. After applying this changes and loading FFI package, OpenGL package loads without any problems (hope it will be working too :).
Now there is another thing needed to be done - going through the code and update it (like "Smalltalk platformName" in OpenGL class>>new, and so on).
If anybody have time to clean it, feel free to be my hero :), if not, I will try to do my best although it will take me longer.
Bye!
Jakub http://www.nabble.com/file/4145/PositionalArgs39.1.cs PositionalArgs39.1.cs
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL
Api
from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: Syntax Error: glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long
ulong)>
Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created
with
a "special" compiler)
Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you
write
a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Sounds promising! Will try to take some time to look at it.
I have been thinking about the respective advantages of OpenGL and SDL for game programming, and I am not at all clear about this. I feel comfortable with the sprite-oriented bitmapped graphics approach of SDL, but I have also realised that it can be a big advantage to use vector graphics also for more traditional 2D games and drawing tools. Then again, you can use OpenGL with SDL if needed.
If one would use OpenGL for bitmapped 2D-sprites, what would be the best/fastest approach? Using glDrawPixels was not very fast when I tested it, because of pixel conversions I guess. Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Best, Micke
On 11/14/06, Jakub Kozisek jakub.kozisek@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I took old PositionalArgs, did minimal changes and installed it into 3.9 image. After applying this changes and loading FFI package, OpenGL package loads without any problems (hope it will be working too :).
Now there is another thing needed to be done - going through the code and update it (like "Smalltalk platformName" in OpenGL class>>new, and so on).
If anybody have time to clean it, feel free to be my hero :), if not, I will try to do my best although it will take me longer.
Bye!
Jakub http://www.nabble.com/file/4145/PositionalArgs39.1.cs PositionalArgs39.1.cs
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL
Api
from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote: > Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: > Syntax Error: > glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) > "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" > <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long
ulong)>
> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created
with
> a "special" compiler) Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you
write
a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Loading-the-OpenGL-package-%28was%3A-Games-with-Squeak... Sent from the Squeak - Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On Nov 14, 2006, at 1:49 PM, Mikael Kindborg wrote:
Sounds promising! Will try to take some time to look at it.
I have been thinking about the respective advantages of OpenGL and SDL for game programming, and I am not at all clear about this. I feel comfortable with the sprite-oriented bitmapped graphics approach of SDL, but I have also realised that it can be a big advantage to use vector graphics also for more traditional 2D games and drawing tools. Then again, you can use OpenGL with SDL if needed.
If one would use OpenGL for bitmapped 2D-sprites, what would be the best/fastest approach? Using glDrawPixels was not very fast when I tested it, because of pixel conversions I guess.
Not just because of that. You still have to upload all of the pixels to the graphics card, each frame. Also, how would you scale/resize your sprite? AFAIK, common OpenGL implementations do not support such operations (I found a Google link to an HP-extension that supports scaling/resizing), so you would need to do this on the CPU.
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Josh
Best, Micke
On 11/14/06, Jakub Kozisek jakub.kozisek@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I took old PositionalArgs, did minimal changes and installed it into 3.9 image. After applying this changes and loading FFI package, OpenGL package loads without any problems (hope it will be working too :).
Now there is another thing needed to be done - going through the code and update it (like "Smalltalk platformName" in OpenGL class>>new, and so on).
If anybody have time to clean it, feel free to be my hero :), if not, I will try to do my best although it will take me longer.
Bye!
Jakub http://www.nabble.com/file/4145/PositionalArgs39.1.cs PositionalArgs39.1.cs
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one
found
in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode
characters
(check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it
may be
worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current
OpenGL
Api
from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
> Diego Fernandez wrote: >> Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9
but I get:
>> Syntax Error: >> glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) >> "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" >> <Argument expected ->apicall: void
'glBindBufferARB' (long
ulong)>
>> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's
created
with
>> a "special" compiler) > Install the FFI from SqueakMap. Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it
lets you
write
a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)",
which
becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this
case is
#glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these
methods, and
fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
-- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/Loading-the- OpenGL-package-%28was%3A-Games-with-Squeak%29-tf2440372.html#a7328706 Sent from the Squeak - Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 11/14/06, Joshua Gargus schwa@fastmail.us wrote:
On Nov 14, 2006, at 1:49 PM, Mikael Kindborg wrote:
If one would use OpenGL for bitmapped 2D-sprites, what would be the best/fastest approach? Using glDrawPixels was not very fast when I tested it, because of pixel conversions I guess.
Not just because of that. You still have to upload all of the pixels to the graphics card, each frame. Also, how would you scale/resize your sprite? AFAIK, common OpenGL implementations do not support such operations (I found a Google link to an HP-extension that supports scaling/resizing), so you would need to do this on the CPU.
I see, thanks.
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Looked at glTexImage2D and the documentation says that width and height must be powers of two, which is not very nice for sprites. However, I saw that in OpenGL 2.1 "Non-Power-Of-Two Textures" are introduced as a standard: http://www.opengl.org/documentation/current_version/
Regards, Micke
On Nov 14, 2006, at 2:40 PM, Mikael Kindborg wrote:
On 11/14/06, Joshua Gargus schwa@fastmail.us wrote:
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Looked at glTexImage2D and the documentation says that width and height must be powers of two, which is not very nice for sprites. However, I saw that in OpenGL 2.1 "Non-Power-Of-Two Textures" are introduced as a standard: http://www.opengl.org/documentation/current_version/
If you are willing to waste some memory, you can always set up your texture coordinates to only include the region of the power-of-two texture that has sprite data. Or, as you say, use NPOT textures. Although they're only now becoming part of the standard, they are usable via extensions of a wide range of hardware.
Josh
Regards, Micke
On 11/14/06, Joshua Gargus schwa@fastmail.us wrote:
On Nov 14, 2006, at 2:40 PM, Mikael Kindborg wrote:
On 11/14/06, Joshua Gargus schwa@fastmail.us wrote:
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Looked at glTexImage2D and the documentation says that width and height must be powers of two, which is not very nice for sprites. However, I saw that in OpenGL 2.1 "Non-Power-Of-Two Textures" are introduced as a standard: http://www.opengl.org/documentation/current_version/
If you are willing to waste some memory, you can always set up your texture coordinates to only include the region of the power-of-two texture that has sprite data. Or, as you say, use NPOT textures. Although they're only now becoming part of the standard, they are usable via extensions of a wide range of hardware.
Josh
Thanks for this info Josh. While I feel more comfortable with SDL sprites, I should look into OpenGL. Squeak already has much of the basic functionality that SDL offers (input, etc), and OpenGL seems to be a very capable option for 2D sprite-based games. Not an easy decision however. Found this nice example of sprites in OpenGL on the gpwiki: http://gpwiki.org/index.php/OpenGL_Tutorial_Framework:Ortho_and_Alpha Will try to recreate this demo in Squeak at some point.
Best, Micke
On Nov 14, 2006, at 23:40 , Mikael Kindborg wrote:
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Looked at glTexImage2D and the documentation says that width and height must be powers of two, which is not very nice for sprites.
Well, it's what the hardware supports efficiently - OpenGL is a very low-level API. You will have to manage this yourself. Like, write a sprite manager that packs many sprites into one large texture.
However, I saw that in OpenGL 2.1 "Non-Power-Of-Two Textures" are introduced as a standard: http://www.opengl.org/documentation/current_version/
... which will take years until it is generally supported. And it won't work on older boards at all.
All in all I'd prefer SDL for 2D games.
- Bert -
On 11/14/06, Bert Freudenberg bert@freudenbergs.de wrote:
On Nov 14, 2006, at 23:40 , Mikael Kindborg wrote:
Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Texture-mapped quads are the way to go.
Looked at glTexImage2D and the documentation says that width and height must be powers of two, which is not very nice for sprites.
Well, it's what the hardware supports efficiently - OpenGL is a very low-level API. You will have to manage this yourself. Like, write a sprite manager that packs many sprites into one large texture.
However, I saw that in OpenGL 2.1 "Non-Power-Of-Two Textures" are introduced as a standard: http://www.opengl.org/documentation/current_version/
... which will take years until it is generally supported. And it won't work on older boards at all.
All in all I'd prefer SDL for 2D games.
- Bert -
Oh, that's bad news, I just got enthusiastic about OpenGL... Then again, using SDL does not rule out OpenGL.
Best regards, Micke
Not just because of that. You still have to upload all of the pixels to the graphics card, each frame. Also, how would you scale/resize your sprite? AFAIK, common OpenGL implementations do not support such operations (I found a Google link to an HP-extension that supports scaling/resizing), so you would need to do this on the CPU.
that part is trivial. Simply create a scaling matrix for whatever scaling you need and make that your modelview matrix. =)
After that it's just a matter of drawing the polygon.
Hello,
I'm having look at it now ... :)
First incompatibilities were found in already mentioned OpenGL class>>new - fix was easy:
1) replaced "Smalltalk platformName" with "SmalltalkImage current platformName"
2) replaced non-existing "Smalltalk windowSystemName" with "SmalltalkImage current getSystemAttribute: 1005" - in 3.9 the windowSystemName is missing .. I'm not deep into it, so I replaced it with implementation in old images - don't want to add anything into SmalltalkImage (or SystemDictionary - that was previous location) unless I get fluent :)
Then I loaded OpenGLMorph from Alexander Lazarevic's changeset - look into http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html .. thanks Alex :)
Now I want to get the morph running in accelerated mode and then put everything into another changeset and do some testing by doing a project.
Sorry for not answering your speed-related question, I haven't any speed testing yet.
Kind regards,
Jakub
Mikael Kindborg-2 wrote:
Sounds promising! Will try to take some time to look at it.
I have been thinking about the respective advantages of OpenGL and SDL for game programming, and I am not at all clear about this. I feel comfortable with the sprite-oriented bitmapped graphics approach of SDL, but I have also realised that it can be a big advantage to use vector graphics also for more traditional 2D games and drawing tools. Then again, you can use OpenGL with SDL if needed.
If one would use OpenGL for bitmapped 2D-sprites, what would be the best/fastest approach? Using glDrawPixels was not very fast when I tested it, because of pixel conversions I guess. Are textures faster? Will have to learn more about this.
Best, Micke
On 11/14/06, Jakub Kozisek jakub.kozisek@gmail.com wrote:
Hello,
I took old PositionalArgs, did minimal changes and installed it into 3.9 image. After applying this changes and loading FFI package, OpenGL package loads without any problems (hope it will be working too :).
Now there is another thing needed to be done - going through the code and update it (like "Smalltalk platformName" in OpenGL class>>new, and so on).
If anybody have time to clean it, feel free to be my hero :), if not, I will try to do my best although it will take me longer.
Bye!
Jakub http://www.nabble.com/file/4145/PositionalArgs39.1.cs PositionalArgs39.1.cs
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander Lazarević Alexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL
Api
from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
> Diego Fernandez wrote: >> Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I
get:
>> Syntax Error: >> glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) >> "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" >> <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long
ulong)>
>> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created
with
>> a "special" compiler) > Install the FFI from SqueakMap. Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you
write
a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
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On 11/13/06 6:55 PM, Jakub Kozisek wrote:
Hello,
I took old PositionalArgs, did minimal changes and installed it into 3.9 image. After applying this changes and loading FFI package, OpenGL package loads without any problems (hope it will be working too :).
Now there is another thing needed to be done - going through the code and update it (like "Smalltalk platformName" in OpenGL class>>new, and so on).
If anybody have time to clean it, feel free to be my hero :), if not, I will try to do my best although it will take me longer.
Bye!
Jakub http://www.nabble.com/file/4145/PositionalArgs39.1.cs PositionalArgs39.1.cs
Just curious if anyone has an updated version of this that works in 3.10.2/Pharo?
Thanks, Phil
Diego Fernandez wrote:
Thanks!! :) I will try to make a Squeak 3.9 compatible version, from the one found in Croquet.
On 11/3/06, Alexander LazarevićAlexander@lazarevic.de wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1
I even found a short description I once wrote at that time about PositionalArgs and the OpenGLApi.
http://www.lazarevic.de/PositionalArgs.html
Regards, Alex
PS: Again, this was all for 3.7. PPS: It seems that only FireFox displays all of the Unicode characters (check, etc.) in the right way.
Alexander Lazarević schrieb:
Hi,
When I played with OpenGL in Squeak (3.7) I used
http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/PositionalArgs37.2.cs
to load in a vanilla 3.7 image to be able to load the OpenGLApi afterwards. I don't know how much has changed in 3.9, but it may be worth a try to load this into a 3.9 image and get the current OpenGL
Api
from CroquetSource after that?
Regards, Alex
Bert Freudenberg schrieb:
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:55 schrieb Andreas Raab:
Diego Fernandez wrote: > Anyway, I'm trying to load OpenGL-ar.36.mcz in Squeak 3.9 but I get: > Syntax Error: > glBindBufferARB(target, buffer) > "This method was generated by OGLExtManager" > <Argument expected ->apicall: void 'glBindBufferARB' (long
ulong)>
> Any clue on how to solve this error? (It looks that it's created
with
> a "special" compiler) Install the FFI from SqueakMap.
Ah, no, that's the positional arg syntax extension ... it lets you
write
a Smalltalk method named "glBindBufferARB(target, buffer)", which becomes the symbol #'glBindBufferARB()/2'.
Each of these methods is installed twice, the other in this case is #glBindBufferARB:with:.
Hmm, might be easier to download croquet, delete these methods, and fileout the rest.
- Bert -
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
iD8DBQFFS2g+YiF2wSTEZ9gRAsgWAJ9tnUR7o/ptiZDugUzhf2i/yrVJvQCdF6dc br4lSJ4+U3ko/TXyxfh32lM= =GBur -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Am 14.10.2006 um 00:40 schrieb Diego Fernandez:
On 10/13/06, Andreas Raab andreas.raab@gmx.de wrote:
Edgar J. De Cleene wrote:
Andreas, as you see no package said " OpenGL" in the provided link.
I think you should learn a little about using Squeaksource: "Versions"
Ouch! I missed the package too, because in www.squeaksource.com usually there is one MC package per "Project".
But there is a nice search feature:
Under projects, type "opengl", it finds the "hedgehog" project, in there go to "versions", it lists those matching "opengl" :)
- Bert -
squeak-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
Alan Grimes -
Alexander Lazarević -
Andreas Raab -
Bert Freudenberg -
Diego Fernandez -
Howard Stearns -
Jakub Kozisek -
Joshua Gargus -
Mikael Kindborg -
Phil