the Difficulty of using squeak

Avi Bryant avi.bryant at
Wed May 11 21:24:45 UTC 2005

On 5/11/05, John H Woods <gmane.squeak at> wrote:
> Ross Boylan <RossBoylan <at>> writes:
> > And then I ran into this weird problem in which changes did not get
> > recorded for a duplicate class I created.  More mysteries to unravel.
> >
> > I'm not saying I can't eventually figure these things out.  I am
> > saying that it's not much fun--in fact, the whole experience has me
> > feeling stupid and frustrated.  And I am saying it's harder than it
> > needs to be.  (Actually somewhat like my experience with Zope, by the
> > way).
> Thanks Ross.  As a new Squeaker, although historically a reasonably proficient
> Smalltalker, I find it very frustrating.  Why are things harder than they seem
> to need to be?  And if they really do need to be that hard, they need a bit
> more documentation.  It would probably be different if we'd been along for the
> ride from the beginning, but ordinary mortals joining the Squeak community now
> face a huge learning curve.  And that seems to be against the spirit of
> Smalltalk, as far as I can see.  I never fought so hard with VisualWorks.

Out of curiosity, and also because I wish that the above weren't true:
are these sentiments mostly related to Morphic development, or to
using Squeak in general?  Ross seems to be  talking specifically about
Morphic, and by contrast my experience with training people to do web
development in Squeak has been fairly positive (once they get over the
idiosyncracies of the look and feel).  But that may have to do with
getting one-on-one training more than anything else.


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