From: Lex Spoon [mailto:lex@cc.gatech.edu] The font and indemnification and export clauses are nothing for someone trying to use Squeak in practice.
You may not export the Software to a national of any US embargoed country, or anyone on a couple of US Government internal lists. Are you sure you never have?
- Peter
On Monday 29 April 2002 10:02 am, Peter Crowther wrote:
From: Lex Spoon [mailto:lex@cc.gatech.edu] The font and indemnification and export clauses are nothing for someone trying to use Squeak in practice.
You may not export the Software to a national of any US embargoed country, or anyone on a couple of US Government internal lists. Are you sure you never have?
It seems remarkably silly to me for Apple to have included the export restrictions in their license.
After all, if you're a US citizen, you're already bound by whatever export restrictions are the law in your country. And if you're not, well, then you're not.
What place do these have in a software license?
Does my exporting the software to the "bad guys" affect Apple in any way, with or without the license mentioning the export regulations?
Ned Konz ned@bike-nomad.com said:
After all, if you're a US citizen, you're already bound by whatever=20 export restrictions are the law in your country. And if you're not,=20 well, then you're not.
Well, you are, because you have accepted the SqueakL in that case. So what Apple is doing is in effect restricting the redistribution of Squeak in some misguided attempt to comply with US regulations *beyond* what would be applicable to a US citizen. And that's what makes it non-OSD compliant (it's in the OSD and even includes a suggested alternative wording, which would be that the license indicates that there may be laws applicable to you that restrict your rights to redistribute).
What place do these have in a software license?
Well, a license falls under contract law I think so both parties are assumed to have total freedom to put any stupid clause they like into the license. If the license would say that you need to stand on your head while the VM starts up, you can choose to accept that or look for some other piece of software.
But they don't have a place in a license that aims to be open source :-)
Does my exporting the software to the "bad guys" affect Apple in any=20 way, with or without the license mentioning the export regulations?
No. In fact, it would probably be good to have the "bad guys" fooling around with Etoys, so that they have less time to plan "bad things" (without going into politics here, I *am* indicating that I will take the freedom to dissent with the US government's definition of "bad")
Does the fact that the plugin exists on the web make these boundaries unenforceable?
Today, what keeps someone from visiting http://www.ViewpointsResearch.org/ and installing the plugin for Squeak?
- Steve
On 4/29/02 1:02 PM, "Peter Crowther" peter.crowther@networkinference.com wrote:
From: Lex Spoon [mailto:lex@cc.gatech.edu] The font and indemnification and export clauses are nothing for someone trying to use Squeak in practice.
You may not export the Software to a national of any US embargoed country, or anyone on a couple of US Government internal lists. Are you sure you never have?
- Peter
Stephan B. Wessels swessels@one.net said:
Does the fact that the plugin exists on the web make these boundaries unenforceable?
Well, formally you would maybe need to make sure that no-one from one of the US government's lists would be able to download the plugin.
Strictly speaking, by allowing unlimited distribution, all sites offering Squeak are in breach of the Squeak License (ok, IANAL and this depends on the current legal meaning of the word "export" applicable to websites - is the site owner performing the act of "export" by making the software available without restrictions, is it the visitor who does the "export", or are they cooperating in accomplishing the "export"? - but it shows that the SqueakL is at best problematic here). I don't think that Apple will sue UIUC, GAtech or VRI for allowing Squeak to roam freely across national borders, but if the term "export" applies to the provider of the website, they probably have their license rights terminated at the moment (clause 2, last sentence).
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