Setools September 2006

setools@lists.squeakfoundation.org

11 participants
23 discussions

Gjallar Error
by Herbert König 13 Oct '06

13 Oct '06

Hello Göran, sorry for the private mail, but this is too big for the list. When going through the screenshots (swiki page 8) I got an error when I wanted to create the case in the developer process. See pointOfError.htm What I did was: Enter a source like in screenshot009.1.png, click on processes, view the development process, use the back button of the browser, reenter the source and click on create case. FullStack.htm is what I got. Then I tried debug, but didn't manage to find something useful in the squeak debugger. So I selected continue, the browser went back to the create case page and this time I could create the case. I used Version 0.2 and updated to Q2v0.2-gk.181.mcz. and an up to date Firefox. Yesterday I played with viewing creating and moving cases. There I had copied the Gjallar directory to a slower computer and had the browser on my laptop. There I also did the update. Then I copied everything back to the laptop. I started with the sample data I get with Q2Model>>recreateDatabase and iirc I issued Q2Scheduler>>stop. I also attach the gjallar log. I have only sporadic internet access right now. Great concept! Regards, Herbert mailto:herbertkoenig@gmx.net

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Re: Re[2]: [Setools] gjallar graphic UI to create a process
by goran＠krampe.se 05 Oct '06

05 Oct '06

Hi! =?ISO-8859-15?B?SGVyYmVydCBL9m5pZw==?= <herbertkoenig(a)gmx.net> wrote: > Hello Göran, > > gks> First of all - cool! It is great that you guys are getting into this and > gks> producing code. And especially Morphic stuff which I probably will stay > gks> clear of, so that gamefield is yours to play with! :) > > my not so good English translates that into "There's work for You to > do" :-)) Hehe, well - I more meant that I will not spend any time on Morphic stuff soon AFAICT. So it was more like "feel free to come up with good solutions, I will not have any strong views on the subject". :) > gks> I opened it up, glanced at the source and played with it. The UI "feel" > gks> didn't work very well with my reflexes - I kept trying to drag the > gks> stages using normal left mouse button for example. But don't let me > gks> influence you - others may feel differently. > > I noticed the same after some time, maybe squeakers are deeply formed > by flaps and the object catalog. I will make both possibilities, so it > works on drag and on click. Dunno how to do this yet but there are > enough examples. > > Deep in the future I think this should run in the squeak plugin and in > a browser we would not try to drag it. Mmmm, the plugin. Yes. Yummy. :) > gks> 1. I would like for all classes in Gjallar to retain the Q2 prefix to > gks> avoid any confusion/collisions and also to make it easy to recognize > gks> Gjallar classes. We could later make a global change of that prefix at > gks> any time - the Q2 letters is an internal name from the customer. > > Noticed that after the release. I wonder what MC will make of renaming > the classes. Duplicate? Will try. I think it handles it. :) > gks> 2. You and Balázs both have Morphic tools but two different class > gks> categories. Either we put them in the same category or we distinguish > gks> them better IMHO. No biggie. > > They aim at different goals and IMO should be kept in different > categories. Then it would be nice if you could name the cats more specifically somehow. Again, no biggie. :) > gks> 3. Put the Documentation class comment in one of the classes itself > gks> (like CreateProcessBigUI) instead. Otherwise we will end up with tons of > > Definitely! Needed my bed when I did this :-)) :) > gks> these "documentation" classes! :) There is only one such "non class" in > gks> Gjallar and that is Q2Gjallar which holds the license as the class > gks> comment and class side high level developer doits only. > > I'm not happy with the class names yet and threw it out so it didn't > get stale here. Having people comment on it gives me little things to > do without having a lot to think. > > gks> I will wait with merging until the above three things are fixed - if it > gks> that is ok with you of course. :) > > I'm not sure what I want, as I don't understand the implications yet > (my first go at MC. Thanks for your intro). My feeling says I'd prefer > it in different mcz, as I fear if it's drowned in the mcz of the whole > Gjallar project it will be slow to save and load as MC has to look at > too many things in doing its work. Working with Gjallar, which is my largest MC project I think, has shown that operations are quite fast. I don't think that is an issue. > I would not mind using your repository and I'll give you a warning > *before* I start messing with anything of the system. Just to keep > your integration work at a minimum. I feel the swiki is the wrong > place for the code. > > What do you say? Yes, the Swiki is the wrong place. :) Feel free to use the repo in any case. There are two options here: 1. Use a different PI name (a different package). You do this by renaming your cats to say "GjallarTool-blabla" and then add a new package in the Monticello browser called "GjallarTool". Thus your code will not be in the "Q2" package and can be considered an optional addon to Gjallar. The positive side is that you are then isolated from Gjallar - I will not need to merge stuff etc. The negatives are of course: - To make adjustments in Gjallar to support your tool you will need to modify the Q2 package and store such snapshots separately for me to pick up and merge. - Not all people will have your addon in their images so when they hack on Gjallar they might change stuff you depend on without really knowing. - Users will need to "know" which version of GjallarTool works with which version of Q2. 2. Use the "Q2" prefix like today. Do not bother warning me - you can make any changes you see fit and save such snapshots to the repo - they will be marked with your initials and since you write a nice summary snapshot comment :) I will have no trouble seeing what you have done and I am free to either merge it in or ignore it. ;) Personally I would prefer for you to take route 2, it is the simplest and also IMHO I want developers to feel that they can dig in, contribute and change Gjallar - that it is not *dangerous* to do that, the worst thing that can happen is that I will not merge it into my "line" and explain why. ;) And non merged versions show up in bold in the repository so it is always very clear what versions are merged in and what are not (from the perspective of the current version in the image). > Cheers, > > Herbert mailto:herbertkoenig@gmx.net regards, Göran

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Process - Case Relation
by HNBeck＠t-online.de 03 Oct '06

03 Oct '06

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[gjallar] no more view cases.
by Herbert König 29 Sep '06

29 Sep '06

Hello Göran, I went into trying Gjallar again but many things (even view cases) don't work. I installed every mcz up to 189. Test Scenario: recreate database, start server (does not work) clean image, start server, stop scheduler, then login. This succeeded after going back to 188. I add the stack trace for view cases. Positive to note: it seems to have become *much* faster. What is the latest more or less stable version? Do I have to start from the zip and install everything in sequenc or can I just *load* the relevant mcz? (I guess so) As squeak.* seems down (website, lists), I send a private mail. Even your swiki seems down. No hurry, won't have time before tomorrow. Thanks, Herbert mailto:herbertkoenig@gmx.net

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gjallar graphic UI to create a process
by Herbert König 27 Sep '06

27 Sep '06

Hello, I have put a preview of the Morphic UI to create Gjallar processes on: http://swiki.krampe.se/gjallar/45 The UI is functional but it does not yet connect to Gjallar. There's a Documentation class which only has a class comment to get you started. It needs beautification but work jumped on me so I did not get as far as I wanted. Please comment! Cheers, Herbert mailto:herbertkoenig@gmx.net

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Gjallar morphic admin console
by Balázs Kósi 27 Sep '06

27 Sep '06

Hi all! We created a morphic console for Gjallar. http://swiki.krampe.se/gjallar/45 Change sets are attached. We changed the behaviour of the ObjectExplorer a bit. Give us your opinion. thanks : balázs

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could we rename this list gjalllar?
by Stéphane Ducasse 25 Sep '06

25 Sep '06

because so far I did not see something else at the level of SE

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Code graphs, and Exploring browser
by Balázs Kósi 24 Sep '06

24 Sep '06

Hi all! As i am trying to comprehend Gjallar and Seaside, i am also thinking about the activity of code comprehension. Let me share some of my toughts about this, from the aspect of tools: The existing tools help the process of understanding code, via showing relations between the entities: * methods sending the examined method's selector * implementors of a selector * methods referencing variables * entrie call stacks * object's holding other objects * object is instance of a class * class superclass relation * ... When i try to understand some aspect of the code, i usually end up with lots of browsers (and explorers, inspectors, workspaces, pointerfinders, debuggers, ...), which contains lots of unnecessary information, overlapping each other and having duplicates. For me, it seems reasonable to build a visual graph from the relevant entities (packages, categories, classes, methods, variables, objects, comments, more?) as nodes, connected by their relations. Basically i imagine the graph building and layouting as a semi-manual process, resembling BabySRE's collaboration diagram, but more specific to smalltalk and more focused on code, more elaborate, and somewhat more automatic.I decided not to go into details. Please tell me about your impressions. One sidenote about the connection with documentation, and the Magic Book idea of coupling doc with code: With the created code graphs we could illustrate documentation. Moreover the code graph could be (or would be) bound to a specific version of code, so you could use it to indicate how outdated the documentation is. thanks: Balázs ps: BabySRE can be installed via SqueakMap. It's written by Trygve Reenskaug. respect. http://heim.ifi.uio.no/~trygver/

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Gjallar.se!
by goran＠krampe.se 24 Sep '06

24 Sep '06

Hi folks! Ok, just enabled gjallar.se and www.gjallar.se! They will get you to the same swiki as before though. The quest for a cool website will soon begin, it would be dandy to have something better looking by the time of OOPSLA (late october), but I haven't even begun to contemplate how we should build it. Some ideas rom the hip though: 1. Make it look like Gjallar - the same layout. :) Not a totally bad idea. 2. Use Pier with some tweaked layout. As wiki implementations go I guess Pier is where the action is today. 3. Modify Gjallar so that it can actually *be* an instance of Gjallar running! This would be slick. And oh, there is no rule saying that we can't have *both* a wiki and a more stylish fixed website of course. I am just weary of maintaining two sites. regards, Göran PS. My latest efforts with readstrategies have paid off - I am not sure if I saved a new snapshot - but performance is much snappier right now, except for the "View cases" component which sucks, but I know why it does. :)

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Plugins in Gjallar
by goran＠krampe.se 21 Sep '06

21 Sep '06

Howdy! Ok, just pushed 185 to the repo - it adds UI support for the Q2PlugIn class that Magnus has previously added. See Q2RandomMovePlugin for an example, see class comment. regards, Göran

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Setools September 2006