Hello all. Several items...
Just to keep everyone posted, Scott has given me instructions on how to add updates to the Squeak update stream. So, SqC has "handed over the keys" so to speak, and I am now the official maintainer of the update stream, more or less.
Of course, my manual handling of the update stream is somewhat temporary... the idea being that with the upcoming harvesting tool, the addition of items to the update stream will become more automated, with a process known to the community. (Although it will probably always require some manual tweaking on occasion.)
I'm about to start working on this harvesting tool (based on SqueakMap 1.05), but it's hard to say when it would be ready to use. I'll shoot for having something ready within a month or so. (with input from this list, of course)
But in the meantime, we probably shouldn't let 3.5alpha stagnate, so I'm going to add some harvesting tables of recent submissions to the ol' superswiki pages one more time. The harvesters/guides/SqC can then review items for inclusion in 3.5alpha, as was the process several months ago. I'll post again as soon as I've added these tables.
Which brings up a question: Who in general should be able to review/approve items to be harvested? I would say the current harvesters + the guides + the SqC folks would be a good starting point. But there are other qualified Squeakers out there, too. For now, if someone else really wants to volunteer to help with harvesting, I could add them to the list of harvesters, and they can help with the swiki tables. However, once the better harvesting tool is in place, harvesting should be somewhat easier (editing the swiki tables is a bit of a pain), so that might be a better time to get more volunteers. (And yes, eventually, once the image is split up into packages, we want to have different people in charge of approving what goes into each package, and maybe have an update stream for each package, if desired. But the first version of the harvesting tool probably won't be package-specific yet.)
Aside from harvesting, there are more general plans which need to be discussed for 3.5. Such as how much of the image should we try to break off into packages, which larger enhancements should be considered, what would be an approximate release date, etc. Someone other than me should lead this discussion, I have enough to do myself. ;-) Daniel led some discussion on this in the past, so perhaps he could continue.
In other news, the 3.4gammaOne image has been out there now for over a week. There haven't been any major bugs reported with it, so I'm thinking that we could probably make this the 3.4 final image in a few days, and then release it on squeak.org. (Of course, a lack of feedback may also mean that not many folks have tested it. I would encourage everyone to at least give it a quick test. The differences in the image itself are relatively minor compared with an image updated from 3.4beta, though... e.g. the contents of the welcome windows have changed a bit. See ftp://st.cs.uiuc.edu/pub/Smalltalk/Squeak/3.4gamma/ )
As we approach the 3.4 final release, we'll want to make sure a few things are in order:
* Make sure that the VM's for various platforms (Mac & Windows at least) are decided upon as the 3.4 VM's to be included in the bundles on squeak.org. Bruce O'Neel would then put the bundles together and update the squeak.org download page accordingly, when we are ready to release.
* Make sure the 3.4 release is announced in all the right places, as described on the "External Relations" SqF swiki page. Cees de Groot is in charge of this.
* Anything else?
Ok, I think that's it for now.
- Doug
This is all good stuff and I want to offer my thanks to everyone that is working so hard on these matters.
I'd really appreciate an update to the sqfixes pages so that we can get to work on the stuff sitting around right now. Better tools for the future are important but we should try to get moving asap.
tim
Tim Rowledge wrote:
This is all good stuff and I want to offer my thanks to everyone that is working so hard on these matters.
I'd really appreciate an update to the sqfixes pages so that we can get to work on the stuff sitting around right now. Better tools for the future are important but we should try to get moving asap.
Okay, I've just put up some new harvesting tables on the sqfixes pages, so we can do some work now, for those interested. 28Jan03 is really the current table, but I also included one from last November, just in case there were some enhancements back then worth looking over.
See:
http://209.143.91.36/super/415
- Doug
A couple of thoughts on the text in the Welcome to... window:-
Since the entire code for the vm is _not_ included (and actually never was except for Macs of course) we should rephrase that bit. How about:- "Squeak is a rapidly moving project based on Smalltalk-80, with which it is still reasonably compatible. Squeak includes a full integrated development environment, networking, sound synthesis and sampling, speech synthesis, 2 & 3D graphics, arithmetic and data structure libraries. It even incorporates tools to produce the core code for its own virtual machine so that you can build your own VM; see <whatever the url for the vm making page on swiki is>"
Why is the old Back to the future page pointed to as an ftp fetch? Can't we put it on the squeak.org website 'normally'?
The Projects section notes "Others, probably more recent than this release, may be found (someday)..." - shouldn't this be less tentative by now?
Although the window furniture is probably reasonably familir looking to most people, it might be worth a) adding a balloon help to the scrollbar widgets b) adding a text morph of some variety tellng people to move the mouse around and let it linger on the icons to find out what they do. That should at least let people know how to open up the other windows!
Other options I can imagine capable morphers producing
a scrolling text morph with a highlights of squeak message a tabbed notebook with pages for each topic a project with lots of explanatory bits and animations, labelled 'Press here for beginners help' in large friendly letters.
tim
Finally replying to this earlier message...
Tim Rowledge wrote:
A couple of thoughts on the text in the Welcome to... window:-
Since the entire code for the vm is _not_ included (and actually never was except for Macs of course) we should rephrase that bit. How about:- "Squeak is a rapidly moving project based on Smalltalk-80, with which it is still reasonably compatible. Squeak includes a full integrated development environment, networking, sound synthesis and sampling, speech synthesis, 2 & 3D graphics, arithmetic and data structure libraries. It even incorporates tools to produce the core code for its own virtual machine so that you can build your own VM; see <whatever the url for the vm making page on swiki is>"
Those changes sound good to me. (I was going to complain the you removed a bit about all source code being included, but that's still covered in the following paragraph in the Welcome window.)
Actually, a minor quibble: Including a longish URL related to VM-making seems like a bit much in the very first intro paragraph to Squeak. Perhaps we can interrupt the flow less by ending your last sentence with "...build your own VM." and then linking just the word "VM" to the VMMaker page on the swiki, by creating an alt-6 DoIt: VM<Scamper openOnUrl: 'http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/2105%27%3E
Why is the old Back to the future page pointed to as an ftp fetch? Can't we put it on the squeak.org website 'normally'?
Not sure, probably a good idea for the next time we update the website. (not high priority, though)
The Projects section notes "Others, probably more recent than this release, may be found (someday)..." - shouldn't this be less tentative by now?
Yes, that should be changed. To what, I don't know. ;-) It looks like the stepping-stone project that it refers to was never fleshed out. Perhaps we should change it to "Other projects may be found by selecting the 'FIND' button on the Navigator bar at the bottom of the screen."
(Of course, the SuperSwiki has been around for awhile now and has lots of older projects and no mechanism for making sure that you're downloading a project that is compatible with 3.4. But what the heck, the Navigator is available anyway so we might as well point it out.)
Although the window furniture is probably reasonably familir looking to most people, it might be worth a) adding a balloon help to the scrollbar widgets b) adding a text morph of some variety tellng people to move the mouse around and let it linger on the icons to find out what they do. That should at least let people know how to open up the other windows!
I think it may be a bit late to include this stuff with 3.4, unless someone comes up with ready-made content. Actually, I'm not sure these two items are really necessary anyway. The "lingering" type of balloon help in Squeak is pretty common in other UIs, and I might argue that scrollbar widgets are so universally recognized these days that adding balloon help there is akin to engraving instructions on a doorknob. ;-) (I don't think Apple provides balloon help for its scrollbars any longer, for example.)
Other options I can imagine capable morphers producing
a scrolling text morph with a highlights of squeak message a tabbed notebook with pages for each topic a project with lots of explanatory bits and animations, labelled 'Press here for beginners help' in large friendly letters.
This stuff would also be good for a future release, if someone wants to work on this.
So in summary, I think we should make the Welcome window changes above for the 3.4 release.
- Doug
As mostly I agree with Doug on his points below. :-) I know - not very creative, but I just want to show my support.
regards, Göran
PS. What email client do you use Doug? Your lines are very long and quoting them is a bit hard...
Doug Way dway@riskmetrics.com wrote:
Finally replying to this earlier message...
Tim Rowledge wrote:
A couple of thoughts on the text in the Welcome to... window:-
Since the entire code for the vm is _not_ included (and actually never was except for Macs of course) we should rephrase that bit. How about:- "Squeak is a rapidly moving project based on Smalltalk-80, with which it is still reasonably compatible. Squeak includes a full integrated development environment, networking, sound synthesis and sampling, speech synthesis, 2 & 3D graphics, arithmetic and data structure libraries. It even incorporates tools to produce the core code for its own virtual machine so that you can build your own VM; see <whatever the url for the vm making page on swiki is>"
Those changes sound good to me. (I was going to complain the you removed a bit about all source code being included, but that's still covered in the following paragraph in the Welcome window.)
Actually, a minor quibble: Including a longish URL related to VM-making seems like a bit much in the very first intro paragraph to Squeak. Perhaps we can interrupt the flow less by ending your last sentence with "...build your own VM." and then linking just the word "VM" to the VMMaker page on the swiki, by creating an alt-6 DoIt: VM<Scamper openOnUrl: 'http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/2105%27%3E
Why is the old Back to the future page pointed to as an ftp fetch? Can't we put it on the squeak.org website 'normally'?
Not sure, probably a good idea for the next time we update the website. (not high priority, though)
The Projects section notes "Others, probably more recent than this release, may be found (someday)..." - shouldn't this be less tentative by now?
Yes, that should be changed. To what, I don't know. ;-) It looks like the stepping-stone project that it refers to was never fleshed out. Perhaps we should change it to "Other projects may be found by selecting the 'FIND' button on the Navigator bar at the bottom of the screen."
(Of course, the SuperSwiki has been around for awhile now and has lots of older projects and no mechanism for making sure that you're downloading a project that is compatible with 3.4. But what the heck, the Navigator is available anyway so we might as well point it out.)
Although the window furniture is probably reasonably familir looking to most people, it might be worth a) adding a balloon help to the scrollbar widgets b) adding a text morph of some variety tellng people to move the mouse around and let it linger on the icons to find out what they do. That should at least let people know how to open up the other windows!
I think it may be a bit late to include this stuff with 3.4, unless someone comes up with ready-made content. Actually, I'm not sure these two items are really necessary anyway. The "lingering" type of balloon help in Squeak is pretty common in other UIs, and I might argue that scrollbar widgets are so universally recognized these days that adding balloon help there is akin to engraving instructions on a doorknob. ;-) (I don't think Apple provides balloon help for its scrollbars any longer, for example.)
Other options I can imagine capable morphers producing
a scrolling text morph with a highlights of squeak message a tabbed notebook with pages for each topic a project with lots of explanatory bits and animations, labelled 'Press here for beginners help' in large friendly letters.
This stuff would also be good for a future release, if someone wants to work on this.
So in summary, I think we should make the Welcome window changes above for the 3.4 release.
- Doug
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